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PO - Brand New - Science Fiction

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1 minute ago, rooks said:

YOU must actually be kidding my friend. 

 

If Stephen King DID suddenly hack his family up one weekend would you look back and say "Oh wow, how'd we not see this one coming boys?? He literally said he was going to do it in the Shining!!"

I never said I thought we should've seen the Lacey stuff coming. Nowhere in my posts did I suggest that. I've been a Brand New fan since Deja and always assumed (hoped?) he was writing characters as a means to criticize problematic behavior. I can't see the lyrics the same way anymore, because I'm a rational person who is considering that maybe someone I admired and gave the benefit of the doubt to for years didn't deserve it.

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8 minutes ago, rooks said:

YOU must actually be kidding my friend.

 

If Stephen King DID suddenly hack his family up one weekend would you look back and say "Oh wow, how'd we not see this one coming boys?? He literally said he was going to do it in the Shining!!"

ummm, yeah people probably would.  trying to understand motivations of people who do horrible things is pretty common.

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1 minute ago, daniel said:

I never said I thought we should've seen the Lacey stuff coming. Nowhere in my posts did I suggest that. I've been a Brand New fan since Deja and always assumed (hoped?) he was writing characters as a means to criticize problematic behavior. I can't see the lyrics the same way anymore, because I'm a rational person who is considering that maybe someone I admired and gave the benefit of the doubt to for years didn't deserve it.

But you must see the jump in logic.

 

There's a difference between "following this new information that Jesse is a creep/pedo, I feel pretty weird about some of his old lyrics" and "Jesse has been writing about taking advantage of underage girls for years".

 

You're pretty big on semantics, so maybe don't insert the "underage" descriptor where it doesn't exist. If the words to Me Vs. Maradona Vs. Elvis were "bring you back to the grade school" instead of "bring you back to the bar" then I'd totally see your point.

 

 

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23 minutes ago, daniel said:

You have got to be kidding me, dude. Those are ridiculous and fantastical examples. Jesse Lacey literally wrote lyrics about taking advantage of underage girls. After the accusations, you see those lyrics the same way? It's not the same at all.

Isn't MvMvE just about taking advantage of girls at the bar and making them think you care about them when you don't? Is there any mention of them being underage (especially considering it takes place at the bar)? Not only is it fiction, but even if it wasn't, it might be scummy but it isn't a crime.

Edited by DecayToDeath

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16 minutes ago, DecayToDeath said:

Isn't MvMvE just about taking advantage of girls at the bar and making them think you care about them when you don't? Is there any mention of them being underage (especially considering it takes place at the bar)? Not only is it fiction, but even if it wasn't, it might be scummy but it isn't a crime.

You're right about that. I was misremembering lyrics from a YFW song, "What difference does this difference in age make", which could refer to a great number of things. But even if you remove the "underage" part from my post, I still stand by what I said. He's written about being a creep and predator.

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2 minutes ago, daniel said:

You're right about that. I was misremembering lyrics from a YFW song, "What difference does this difference in age make", which could refer to a great number of things. But even if you remove the "underage" part from my post, I still stand by what I said. He's written about being a creep and predator.

If you made the song more jaunty and upbeat it would play out like something Barney Stinson would do on How I Met Your Mother. Just a song about a smooth-talking guy who gets a girl to go to bed with him. There's a strong argument for that being shitty behavior but I don't think that makes the narrator a predator by any means.

 

The leap in logic here is ludicrous. Like I said in a prior post a few pages back, should we have "seen it coming" that he's also a mobster and a murderer because he penned Luca? No. It might not be a coincidence that he wrote this song, but we can't just look at songs from artists' repertoires, take them at face value, and assume it's logical to make assumptions or to "see it coming" that they do the same things that a fictional narrator in one of their songs did. 

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5 minutes ago, DecayToDeath said:

If you made the song more jaunty and upbeat it would play out like something Barney Stinson would do on How I Met Your Mother. Just a song about a smooth-talking guy who gets a girl to go to bed with him. There's a strong argument for that being shitty behavior but I don't think that makes the narrator a predator by any means.

 

The leap in logic here is ludicrous. Like I said in a prior post a few pages back, should we have "seen it coming" that he's also a mobster and a murderer because he penned Luca? No. It might not be a coincidence that he wrote this song, but we can't just look at songs from artists' repertoires, take them at face value, and assume it's logical to make assumptions or to "see it coming" that they do the same things that a fictional narrator in one of their songs did. 

To be fair, @daniel never said he could "see it coming". That's not the point.

 

It's just about acknowledging the difference between inferring and projecting.

 

It's totally fair to look back at the lyrics now and say "wow, I consider that kind of creepy in light of new information", aka inferring based on current knowledge that there may be some nefarious/creepy angle to some of the meaning that you choose to see behind these lyrics.

 

It's not totally fair to project your (correct) beliefs about Jesse being a pedo on old lyrics and make statements as a matter of fact, like "he's been singing about abusing underage girls for years".

 

I think we're on the same page, now. That's all.

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22 minutes ago, DecayToDeath said:

The leap in logic here is ludicrous. Like I said in a prior post a few pages back, should we have "seen it coming" that he's also a mobster and a murderer because he penned Luca? No. It might not be a coincidence that he wrote this song, but we can't just look at songs from artists' repertoires, take them at face value, and assume it's logical to make assumptions or to "see it coming" that they do the same things that a fictional narrator in one of their songs did. 

Again, you're comparing two very different things. Jesse Lacey being a mobster is far-fetched. Him being an abuser is not. Not because of his lyrics, but because it's simply a much more realistic scenario for a person to be an abuser than a "mobster". Also, let's not forget, HE ADMITTED TO IT.

Edited by daniel

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9 minutes ago, veggiecorecords said:

So who wants to buy all my brand new records? 

Look, up in the clouds, do you see that?

The virtue signal is shining bright! Virtue man is speeding from his virtue cave as we speak.

Everyone, quick, sell all your records for an exorbitant amount even though you've already supported this band and it does absolutely nothing besides make you some quick money.

 

That said, I'll give you $5ppd for them all.

Edited by The Ghost of Randy Savage

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Guaranteed every keyboard warrior in this thread sits in silence like a little bitch when anything that actually requires real effort presents itself to them in real life. Like that burger king commercial.

 

Y'all literally have a slimeball rolling through this thread only pointing out how good music is from other pedophiles yet you choose to argue about some speculative shit. Get a life lol.

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1 minute ago, The Ghost of Randy Savage said:

Look, up in the clouds, do you see that?

The virtue signal is shining bright! Virtue man is speeding from his virtue cave as we speak.

Everyone, quick, sell all your records for an exorbitant amount even though you've already supported this band and it does absolutely nothing besides make you some quick money.

 

That said, I'll give you $5ppd for them all.

Yea I mean... if these records were that "disgusting" wouldn't everyone just be giving them away for free?

 

Or perhaps this is an elaborate ruse to rouse the pedo-apologists that will still treasure their beloved Brand New?

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4 hours ago, conedust said:

But it's not like there's been any shortage of misogynist bullshit in this thread, what with Sunshine straight-up lying about Larkin Grimm...

I thought you didn't call people liars lightly? Lmao I know the pitchfork article you read doesn't have all the info from what happened so it's pointless to call me a liar when you didn't follow the story and can only find tidbits. 

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7 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

I thought you didn't call people liars lightly? 

I don't. You've lied; so I feel pretty comfortable calling you the liar you obviously are. And you're too helplessly stupid to be worth the time a real discussion might take. So let's just leave it at that.

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7 minutes ago, conedust said:

I don't. You've lied; so I feel pretty comfortable calling you the liar you obviously are. And you're too helplessly stupid to be worth the time a real discussion might take. So let's just leave it at that.

One special trophy for one special guy.

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