Problem tracking at beginning of record

[gabpower]

Hello folks!

 

For a few weeks now, my needle is jumping at the beginning of my records. Not all of them but a lot.

 

I did not modify my turntable prior to this problem and no one else but me touched it.

 

I thought the problem was mostly because I played Epitaph pressings but it's also occurring to previously fine records.

 

My turntable is a Denon DP300-F with a cheap generic needle made for my stock cartridge and has been used for a year and a half without any problem (will be replaced eventually with a Grado Red). The needle is fine and I clean it once in a while with a dedicated solution. I also always brush my records and clean them when they need to so they're not the problem.

I did reset the weight in the back of the tonearm and calibrated it again and again without success. I played with the anti-skating knob without success.

The turntable is level with the ground and stable on my Expedit without anything else touching it. My speakers are separated on the floor and not touching the Expedit.

I printed a protractor alignment paper and it seems fine but I ordered a real one with a mirror finish for exact calibration just in case. 

My needle seems to be just a little bit crooked on the side (very little) so maybe that's where the problem lies but it's always been like that and it's been fine since this recent problem.

 

One thing I did not try yet is to put the needle on a blank record and check how it's tracking.

 

Any other ideas are welcome to help me solve this problem.

 

If you barely know anything about turntable settings, please refrain from making any witty remarks or suggestions.

 

Thanks for your help!

 

 

[3arl]

Is there an adjustable counterweight on it?

[gabpower]

Yes I adjusted it at 2g and 1.5g. I am not sure what's the best weight for my needle.

[thebiglebowski]

You have the manual?

 

http://usa.denon.com/us/Product/Pages/ProductDetail.aspx?pcatid=AudioComponents(DenonNA)&CatId=Turntables(DenonNA)&PId=DP300F(DenonNA)

 

if it is the needle that came with it, you want 2 grams.

 

You shouldn't "play" with the anti-skating setting. You should set it the number of grams on the counterweight. Are you jacking that thing up to 10 thinking it will stop it from skipping?

 

Just asking but you seem to know what you are doing.

[thebiglebowski]

When you say beginning of records, you mean like during the first song or the very first time the needle hits a groove? I don't know what the explanation is but it seems like that is the most common time for a record to skip.

 

Maybe it doesn't immediately "lock" into the groove? It bounces for a second before it finds its place? It might just be part of listening to records. It's not a bunch of ones and zeros that play the react same way every time on a micro level.

[gabpower]

Let's say it's skipping through the first song or first 5 minutes.

 

I followed this man's setup instructions to make sure I did everything right : 

 

I just tested my anti-skate with a blank record and it seems I was way off at 2g. To make the tonearm stable on the blank surface, I had to put it to 4g. Even then it kind of tends to move to center at times maybe because of the record's slight imperfections.

 

I'm in this small house that moves a bit during winter and it's not as leveled as last summer. If I put a marble on the ground he can see it moving instantly to a corner. Maybe a slight tilt of the whole house could be responsible for this. 

 

I just put on a new Metallica 45 rmp album and it's good so far with the anti-skate at 4g. I'll move back to a few recent records that did not do well like Bad Religion - True North and Bad Religion - The Dissent Of Man.

[thebiglebowski]

Yeah 5 minutes is obviously a problem on a different level as missing one line when the groove hits.

 

4 grams might not be out of line. The cartridge that came with my audio technica suggests 3.5 grams.

 

Just for the hell of it, I popped a 500 page paperback under two of the corners of my turntable (1 at a time) and played a record (so it was at a major tilt). Played fine. So I don't think a slight tilt to your house will cause problems to a properly functioning turntable.

[bearchuck]

There's some debate about this, but the majority of knowledgeable people that I trust say that the blank record test is not a good way to set your anti skate.  Stick with setting it at the same tracking force as the cartridge.

 

It sounds like you're trying all the right things, which is good.  Something is causing mistracking though, and if this is a new problem and nothing else in your setup has changed, maybe it is the cartridge.  1.5 years is a bit short in terms of the stylus' lifespan - unless of course you're playing records every day for many hours at a time - but if it's a cheap cartridge then maybe it's past its prime.  Chances are it was never a great tracker in the first place.

 

I would love to see you try the Grado regardless, simply because I think you'll like the sound of it.  But if you're trying to solve the problem with the old cartridge, my only other suggestion would be to maybe try a record weight / clamp / stabilizer.  You'll have to do your research and figure out what's right for your TT, but it should help cut down on any unwanted vibrations, resonance, etc etc.

 

Also, don't assume that your house is level.  Get a small bubble level (they're super cheap) and find out how level your turntable is.  If it's off, try some blu-tack under the feet to level it off.  I kinda doubt that's the problem, but in general you want your TT to be as level as possible.

[gabpower]

Thanks for the replies so far.

 

I just found out that the needle is shaking and jumping when the volume is high. When muted or very faint, it's not shaking. When medium and higher, it starts to shake and eventually jump when the music gains in momentum. It could certainly be a vibration problem.

 

Another test I just did confirmed it was due to vibrations on my main speakers. I have another set of speakers going in another room and my amp can switch with both pair and the needle stops shaking when it's only playing in the other room.

 

I could look into vibration absorbing feet for the speakers I guess. I can't really move the speakers due to lack of space and to keep some optimal speaker positioning in my little house. Keep in mind the speakers are not touching the shelf, they have a distance of about 1cm.

 

I'd like ideas and suggestions if there's anything else I could do.

 

 

Here's my current setup for your info :

[bearchuck]

Anchor the expedit to the wall with a pair of L-shaped brackets.  I believe the unit comes with some, but anything from Home Depot will do.  That will help with vibration and footfalls, big time ... and it's a really cheap solution too.

[ajxd]

Yup. Also make some sort of isolation for the turntable. Also.... are those speakers rear ported? If so... pull em off the wall. Also, carpet spikes, plus a small square of carpet never hurts under the speakers. Or small squares of granite/mdf/etc under the speakers.

[gabpower]

Thanks for the suggestions. I just put some rubber feets under my speakers and the problem did not happen after 3 records at high volume. So far, so good. I'll keep you posted if there's more. Have a great weekend.