jchusky77 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Hi! I just bought a used Numark TT200, not the USB, from my local vinyl shop. I have a lot of old records from the 70s courtesy of my dad. I do have a phono pre-amp going to my Pioneer AVR then to Goldenear Soundarray. Which looks like a soundbar but is in fact three separate speakers with 3 separate inputs. (LCR) After I set up the new TT, I put on a record. I have some new and old ones. I tried a new one and I noticed the highs (vocals) sounded fine but the mid sounded flat. I tried an old record and noticed the same. I really havent tweaked with the sound processing in my AVR. but is the mid flat sound normal for vinyl? its been a long time since Ive listend to vinyl. What setting should I use? Thank you for your help!! Jonathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxsilence Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 That's not vinyl, that's the rest of your equipment. I don't expect a sound bar to get very good mids in a stereo setup. It's probably focusing on center channel (where most dialogue and voices are) and bass (since that's what most movie/theater systems value). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchusky77 Posted November 6, 2015 Author Share Posted November 6, 2015 Ok thanks! I'll have to tinker with my AVR settings then. Its not a "soundbar" per se. This is what I have http://www.goldenear.com/products/supercinema3d It sounds great with other digital music sources, so I'll have to play around to get the 2 channel set up right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Make sure you're not in some kind of theater mode or any sort of active equalization. Look for some sort of Direct or Pure sound mode. The receiver might be able to identify and handle digital music correctly but may not know what to do with an analog signal. Otherwise, a turntable is kind of a square peg for most AV receivers and you may simply not be able to get a good result with your setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchusky77 Posted November 6, 2015 Author Share Posted November 6, 2015 Thanks for the tip! Also, when I say flat..I mean from a musical sense. The actual notes sound out of tune compared to the rest of the music. Not sure if this helps at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Well this is nearly impossible. Either everything would sound sharp or flat, or none of it would. Still, I blame the numark. Easiest solution - don't listen to records. Best solution - grab a better table. Most sensible solution - maybe think about upgrading the cartridge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Sort of a different story. Do you have anything else you can connect the table to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allenh Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 a turntable is kind of a square peg for most AV receivers and you may simply not be able to get a good result with your setup. I'd say that pretty much covers it with most average AVR's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kannibal Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I'd say that pretty much covers it with most average AVR's I don't buy that. It may not sound as good as hi-fi stereo gear but it shouldn't sound wrong. It sounds fine from a digital input, so it should sound the same across the part of the chain shared by the sources. That being said there is no way the vocals sound in-tune and the mids flat. Just not possible. Reading as initially thought, as in flat dynamics, it could be a setting on the AVR. Either a surround mode, or the LFE filter is set very high. It could also be a defective preamp, or turntable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
circuit bored records Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 I personally think the bottleneck in this set up is the turntable (and probably moreso the cartridge on it which I don't believe was mentioned) and the passive Soundbar. If digital sounds fine on the speaker to the user and vinyl doesn't it really comes down to the TT/cartridge combo. I mean, if it's a $25 POS cartridge with a ceramic stylus than I would absolutely expect a digital source to sound better by comparison. But also any speaker that has Cinema in the name and more than 2 channel capability clearly was not designed for music playback as a priority. Less of an issue for the OP though since he likes the sound other sources playing music so i think that definitely narrows down his troubleshooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allenh Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 I don't buy that. It may not sound as good as hi-fi stereo gear but it shouldn't sound wrong. It sounds fine from a digital input, so it should sound the same across the part of the chain shared by the sources. I assumed digital in meant optical or coaxial in meaning that the analogue input stage could be poor or faulty. That said it is unlikely it will be that bad unless there is a physical fault and I agree the problem is likely to be either a mode setting for that input or set of inputs or if not in the turntable or phono stage, the only other way to know for sure is to try all the different modes to see what differences you can make or plug the turntable into a different amplifier. One thing that does spring to mind though is the speaker unit in that are you using the amp in 2channel mode? If so is the centre speaker being in the same box acting like a passive radiator and making unwanted sound which I'm assuming with it being a smallish cone would be around the mid range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchusky77 Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 The soundbar is not a soundbar like you all think it is. Its three separate channels just arranged in an array. The speakers arent the issue. I made a recording of the sound it made from my phone and I will bring the whole unit back to the place I bought it from, hopefully theyll return it, or I'll sell it on craigslist to the next wannabe DJ lol Actually...when listening to the recording anytime a note is held for a beat or more, its wavering. Is this a weight issue of the arm? Vinyl isnt warped. Should it be the TT, do you recommend waiting until the new Technics come back out? Get a marantz? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 The new technics isn't going to be cheap, but sure. "Get a Marantz" is kind of a broad statement. Of their current line, only the TT-15S1 is worth owning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allenh Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 It's a direct drive table so it can't be a belt issue and for the weight of the arm to be great enough for it to have that sort of effect it would be heavy enough that the cartridge body would be running on the surface of the record and you'd definitely be hearing that. I agree the turntable somewhere must be the issue and if you are going to replace it and you have to have new then the beginners thread will have all the usual suggestions but if you are brave enough to go 2nd hand there is an enormous choice with an enormous price range, again the beginners thread will be a help here but it will be a long read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 kind of random...but where do you have your turntable placed in relation to your speakers? normally I would expect bass to be the instigator with a placement issue but since your speakers are probably only handling the highs/mids, the mids might be enough to rattle your table if they're placed on the same surface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchusky77 Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 my speakers are on the wall. My TT is inside a cabinet. The TT weights like 30 lbs. The sub is on the opposite side. I will return the TT and see what I can find on CL. Will be reading the beginners forum as well. Thank you all for your input!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxmartinxx Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Since the OP doesn't appear to know the difference between highs, lows, mids, pitch, his ass, a hole in the ground, etc, he/she should just invest digital music. Turntables are hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 The TT weights like 30 lbs. This number seems suspiciously high to me. Unless you're measuring this on a planet eight times the mass of Earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
circuit bored records Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 The soundbar is not a soundbar like you all think it is. That's why I called it a passive soundbar, which is what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchusky77 Posted November 10, 2015 Author Share Posted November 10, 2015 why do people have to be such elitist jerks on message boards? Are you the first person to ever invest in a turntable and vinyl and are pissed that everyone is hopping on your bandwagon? You cant be trendy anymore? I asked a simple question. Ive been in music my whole life, I understand musical terms. So xxmartinxx, go be brave behind your keyboard, listen to you limited edition ultra rare japanese only cut of your trendy shit and sit on your ivory throne. You are whats wrong with the internet. To the others who actually gave helpful advice, thank you for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 2/10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freki Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 Are you the first person to ever invest in a turntable and vinyl and are pissed that everyone is hopping on your bandwagon? You cant be trendy anymore? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxmartinxx Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 why do people have to be such elitist jerks on message boards? Are you the first person to ever invest in a turntable and vinyl and are pissed that everyone is hopping on your bandwagon? You cant be trendy anymore? I asked a simple question. Ive been in music my whole life, I understand musical terms. So xxmartinxx, go be brave behind your keyboard, listen to you limited edition ultra rare japanese only cut of your trendy shit and sit on your ivory throne. You are whats wrong with the internet. To the others who actually gave helpful advice, thank you for your input. I like your word "invest". That's important to the conversation. What are your intentions of getting into records? Because they're cool, trendy, and hip or because you're interested in increased fidelity over other mediums? I'd like to give you the benefit of the doubt and I'll assume the latter. If so, then you shouldn't get into it half-assed. Buying a poorly designed and cheaply made turntable second hand, then plugging it into a soundbar is the definition of half-assed. You are better listening to MP3's than doing that. It's cheaper, be less of a hassle, and sound better. Contrary to your belief, I actually LOVE that people are getting into records. I want people to remain into them and for people to remain into them, they need to get the most out of their records with the least amount of frustration. Getting the most out of them requires buying a decent turntable, amplifier, and speakers, which means an investment of multiple hundreds of dollars. (I would prefer thousands, but I'm trying to be realistic). It means an investment of learning how to set up a turntable. It means learning about the care and cleaning of records. You went to a messageboard dedicated to the gear you can't be bothered to properly invest in, vaguely describe your problem, and then got pissy when you received a response calling you out. Sorry, not sorry. I may be "what's wrong with the internet", but you're what's wrong with society. You want the benefit of things without properly investing your own time and money into in them and then you want other people to fix it for you when it doesn't work. For the TL,DR folks; take back your crap turntable, then, after reading "Beginners Guide To Turntables" thread, buy a real turntable, amp, and speakers. If you have issues then, feel free to ask for help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearchuck Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Hey friends. Been a hot minute since I last visited VC, but things are pretty much as I remember them; newbies are clueless yet eager to learn and adorably defensive; the pros are helpful and well-meaning while often over-explaining solutions to the simplest problems; and then there's that one guy. You know ... the one who initiates the shit-talking and then sermonizes a twisted ideology claiming to welcome all to the hobby with open arms while simultaneously belittling the ones who don't follow his path as the plague of society. Ha ha ... that guy ... he's a real douchenozzle, amarite? Anyway, OP has a pitch issue. I guarantee it. Bad motor, capacitor ... I don't know, and probably not worth fixing. Either way, sounds like they've moved on to greener pastures, so cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchusky77 Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 I brought it back into the record store I bought it from. They plugged it in and noticed the same issue. The motor was bad and wasn't tracking right and causing the sound issue. They took it back for full credit. I plan on buying a new Pro-Ject debut after reading the beginners forums 8) So heres the next question......whats the best "test" record you love to play to get a full sense of that sound! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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