Just ordered a Marantz... now I can be cool, too.

[xxmartinxx]

I've found that I'm spending very little time actually listening to records so I decided to downgrade my Audio Research VSi55 to something cheaper.  Initially, I wanted to stick with something with tubes, but there just isn't anything out there that would put enough money in my pocket that isn't really cheaply made Chinese junk.  So, I started looking at lower cost solid state amps.  It was between an Emotiva TA-100 and the Marantz PM6005.  I couldn't find a single review of the Emotiva, so I went with the Marantz, since it wasn't much more money.  This will be interesting since I haven't owned a solid state stereo amplifier in over 15 years.  I'm scared.  Hold me.

[ajxd]

Welcome to the dark si-- wait no...

 

I do wonder what you'll think going back to SS after all this time.

[kannibal]

Why is this going to help you spend more time listening to records? 

 

Worse quality, and it's going to be worse, would make me spend less time with music.

[slinch]

From what I understand he's saying that he spends so little time listening to music it isn't worth having more expensive equipment.

 

But I get where he's coming from either way, I honestly spend way less time listening to records now that I have a good table than I did back with my $10 flea market junker. That thing took a beating and I didn't have to be careful so there was almost always something spinning, now I have to watch my every move and it's all so precise and so delicate and just such a hassle I often don't even find it to be worth it and just open my (free, mind you) deezer account.

 

This post made me sad.

[Thomas³]

5 minutes ago, slinch said:

From what I understand he's saying that he spends so little time listening to music it isn't worth having more expensive equipment.

 

But I get where he's coming from either way, I honestly spend way less time listening to records now that I have a good table than I did back with my $10 flea market junker. That thing took a beating and I didn't have to be careful so there was almost always something spinning, now I have to watch my every move and it's all so precise and so delicate and just such a hassle I often don't even find it to be worth it and just open my (free, mind you) deezer account.

 

This post made me sad.

I've slowly found myself doing the same lately. When I had my cheap table, I didn't care much about it or my records (which is the bad part). Now I have to wash them, and dust them, etc. It was simpler before, and I seemed to enjoy it more. Usually listen to ALAC over Airplay, unless I'm really feeling like a record (usually listen to them all day on Sundays though).

[lexicondevil]

16 minutes ago, slinch said:

From what I understand he's saying that he spends so little time listening to music it isn't worth having more expensive equipment.

 

But I get where he's coming from either way, I honestly spend way less time listening to records now that I have a good table than I did back with my $10 flea market junker. That thing took a beating and I didn't have to be careful so there was almost always something spinning, now I have to watch my every move and it's all so precise and so delicate and just such a hassle I often don't even find it to be worth it and just open my (free, mind you) deezer account.

 

This post made me sad.

This made me sad, too. This is why I have carefully tried to stay away from being a hi fi audiophile. I have always believed that audiophiles actually enjoy music less than people who just listen and enjoy the music for the composition and lyrics. Even when I upgraded to a Debut Carbon I was a little concerned that it was going to send me down a dark, expensive path. I am more than happy with that turntable and my 70's Marantz receiver. I do need to upgrade my speakers, but that will be it.

[kannibal]

2 hours ago, slinch said:

From what I understand he's saying that he spends so little time listening to music it isn't worth having more expensive equipment.

 

But I get where he's coming from either way, I honestly spend way less time listening to records now that I have a good table than I did back with my $10 flea market junker. 

First paragraph makes sense, but martin also has a history of swapping and upgrading and trying different things. Next monty he'll be changing his system (upgrading) again.

 

As to the second part, so much for that lauded German engineering, huh?

Edited January 9, 2017 by kannibal

[kannibal]

1 hour ago, lexicondevil said:

This made me sad, too. This is why I have carefully tried to stay away from being a hi fi audiophile. I have always believed that audiophiles actually enjoy music less than people who just listen and enjoy the music for the composition and lyrics. Even when I upgraded to a Debut Carbon I was a little concerned that it was going to send me down a dark, expensive path. I am more than happy with that turntable and my 70's Marantz receiver. I do need to upgrade my speakers, but that will be it.

Very ignorant, blanket statement there. I'm not sure if I am an audiophile, but I have equipment that at retail totals the price of a used car. I love and enjoy music more than I ever have. The increased sound quality gives me an experience I was never able to have with lesser equipment. These experiences have only increased my love of music, performance, and sound. 

 

I dont think I could argue with the start-up and care aspect being a pain in the ass when I just want something quick and easy, but that's what digital is for. Thing is, an expensive great sounding setup will sound great both with serious and casual listening so why sacrifice? 

[xxmartinxx]

Slinch and Kannibal are both correct.  There's a few mitigating factors that influenced by decision to try to "downgrade", but lack of time to listen is at the top.  I'm basically listening to records once every few months.  That being said, I do have a history of buying gear.  This is the first time I'm going backward though.  Most moves have been up or at least lateral.  

 

It's interesting that people are listening to music less after upgrading their turntables.  I wonder what that is?  Are you guys going from automatic tables to a manual tables?

[xxmartinxx]

3 minutes ago, kannibal said:

Very ignorant, blanket statement there. I'm not sure if I am an audiophile, but I have equipment that at retail totals the price of a used car. I love and enjoy music more than I ever have. The increased sound quality gives me an experience I was never able to have with lesser equipment. These experiences have only increased my love of music, performance, and sound. 

 

I dont think I could argue with the start-up and care aspect being a pain in the ass when I just want something quick and easy, but that's what digital is for. Thing is, an expensive great sounding setup will sound great both with serious and casual listening so why sacrifice? 

 

I think there's some truth to what he was trying to say.  For sure thereare people who are more into the gear or hunt for better sound than listening to actual music.  I don't think that's the majority of "audiophiles".  

 

I agree with your basic premise that if you love music you're cheating yourself if you don't upgrade to decent stuff (whatever level of "decent" you feel comfortable with).  When I stuck  my foot into hi-fi fifteen or so years ago, I bought a vintage integrated tube amp that I completely overhauled and a Musical Hall MMF.5.  I found the sound of that table fairly  underwhelming.  When I upgraded to my VPI Scout a year or two later, that's when I was really impressed with the sound quality I was getting out of vinyl.  Until then, CD's sounded better and I was only buying records for things I couldn't get on CD.  After that is when I preferred to buy vinyl, eventually refusing to buy CD's at all.  

 

It's a fun and rewarding hobby, I just don't have the time to dedicate to it that I would like.  

[ajxd]

16 hours ago, xxmartinxx said:

It's a fun and rewarding hobby, I just don't have the time to dedicate to it that I would like.  

This.

[jessejames690]

Well enjoy the PM6005. You won't beat the sound for the buck. Solid amp

[lexicondevil]

17 hours ago, kannibal said:

Very ignorant, blanket statement there. I'm not sure if I am an audiophile, but I have equipment that at retail totals the price of a used car.

No need to get your panties in a bunch. Damn.

[kannibal]

Panties weren't nor are they currently in a bunch. I just disagreed with the generalization of people who prefer high quality audio not enjoying music as much someone with a entry level or worse setup. It's absurd. 

[lexicondevil]

1 hour ago, kannibal said:

Panties weren't nor are they currently in a bunch. I just disagreed with the generalization of people who prefer high quality audio not enjoying music as much someone with a entry level or worse setup. It's absurd. 

The content of my original statement made it an obvious generalization. It wasn't directed at you or anyone in particular. On the other hand, your "ignorant" comment just makes you look like an asshole.  And if you're equipment equals the price of a car then, yes, you are an audiophile along with the stereotypical attitude.

[kannibal]

1 hour ago, lexicondevil said:

 

Edited January 10, 2017 by kannibal
VC mobile, I guess?

[allenh]

22 hours ago, kannibal said:

Very ignorant, blanket statement there. I'm not sure if I am an audiophile, but I have equipment that at retail totals the price of a used car. I love and enjoy music more than I ever have. The increased sound quality gives me an experience I was never able to have with lesser equipment. These experiences have only increased my love of music, performance, and sound.

Yep, yep, yep, Oh and yep again.

 

xxmartinxx if you could hand your ID card for the HiFi society in to the nice lady at the door that will be fine.

 

I'm with kannibal on this one, I reckon you'll miss those glowing bottles and pretty soon. All through my HiFi life my listening habits have come and gone based on life in general but I have definitely regretted every time I've just turned good kit into money without a like for like or better replacement.

[kannibal]

1 hour ago, lexicondevil said:

The content of my original statement made it an obvious generalization. It wasn't directed at you or anyone in particular. On the other hand, your "ignorant" comment just makes you look like an asshole.  And if you're equipment equals the price of a car then, yes, you are an audiophile along with the stereotypical attitude.

Generalization or not that doesn't change my feeling that it was an ignorant, blanket statement. In fact, it just serves to reinforce my statement. I had a feeling you would get offended by the word ignorant, and you resorting to name calling in response just confirms how ignorant your statements was. You can't back up your statement and you just start calling names and talking about bunched up panties. It doesn't really seem like you know what you're talking about.

 

Edited January 10, 2017 by kannibal

[lexicondevil]

[TheGhostOfRandySavage]

9 hours ago, lexicondevil said:

The content of my original statement made it an obvious generalization. It wasn't directed at you or anyone in particular. On the other hand, your "ignorant" comment just makes you look like an asshole.  And if you're equipment equals the price of a car then, yes, you are an audiophile along with the stereotypical attitude.

I get what you're saying for sure. Sometimes those sort of generalizations get people a little upset because they internalize it, but I think most of us realize you're not really saying all audiophiles just don't enjoy music...just that it sometimes seems there is an inverse correlation between enjoyment of music and how much of an audiophile people consider themselves to be.

 

8 hours ago, kannibal said:

Generalization or not that doesn't change my feeling that it was an ignorant, blanket statement. In fact, it just serves to reinforce my statement. I had a feeling you would get offended by the word ignorant, and you resorting to name calling in response just confirms how ignorant your statements was. You can't back up your statement and you just start calling names and talking about bunched up panties. It doesn't really seem like you know what you're talking about.

 

Your response was pretty pointed and it came off as though you were looking for a little bit of a fight. His comment was an opinion more than likely based on his personal experiences. It's tough to start a constructive discussion about something when you immediately call someone out as ignorant.

I know when I started getting "more serious" about collecting records and started caring more about how they sounded/upgrading my system (however small those upgrades may seem to anyone else) I personally started having a little less fun. While that could also be attributed to other factors, I usually most associate it with the change in how I listened to music. I'm sure he didn't mean to offend anyone by his statement.

[ajxd]

Will all you quit whipping your dicks out. Let's get to the matter at hand.

 

When's the Marantz showing up? Will you video your reactions of listening to it the first time? Can we taste your tears?

 

[xxmartinxx]

Friday... and my tears can be imbibed by all.

[xxmartinxx]

On 1/10/2017 at 4:06 PM, allenh said:

xxmartinxx if you could hand your ID card for the HiFi society in to the nice lady at the door that will be fine.

Edited January 11, 2017 by xxmartinxx

[xxmartinxx]

Not sure why I can't add text to the above message.

 

Anyway.  Do I really have to give back my card when I plugging in a $2000 turntable and  $1000 preamp into it?  Actually, that might make it worse.  Nevermind.

Edited January 11, 2017 by xxmartinxx

[xxmartinxx]

Well, the gods of FedEx Ground decided to reward my bad decisions with a gift.  They brought it a day early.   I honored them with listening to side two of Dinosaur Jr.s "Green Mind" (the reissue).  I picked this because it's not a great sounding album and there are some potentially horrible sounding guitar parts.  

 

As I pulled it out of the carton, I couldn't decide if I should be happy or disappointed with the build quality.  The speaker jacks appeared much nicer in the pictures than they looked and felt in person.  There was some decent weight to the thing.  Whatever.  I gave a quick listen to the ARC to give me some context.  I dislocate my ARC, plop it into place on my rack, and plug it in.  And then I look for the power button.  Um...  Power button?  Seems kind of imperative to one of those.  Finally I find it under the giant input select knob, which completely hides it from my vantage point.  Great placement.  Finally, I power it on.  Lights blink then black.  Hmmm...  Press the button again.  Nothing.  Check both sides of the power cable.  Seems fine.  Now it works.  I guess it needed a moment?  I dunno.  I hope that doesn't become a thing.  

 

Now I have power but no sound.  I check the phono preamp.  That's on.  I press the speaker select button.  Ah...  wrong speakers.  I decide I should compare the ARC to the Marantz with the EQ out of the chain, because that makes sense.  Well, that sounds like dogshit.  It sounds better with the EQ on.  Okay,  if not no EQ than a flat EQ with the bass and treble at 50%.  Not distractingly different than the ARC.  As I start listening, things start sounding harsher, more rigid, and I start to get a throbbing headache.  I get the solo on "Green Mind" and it is physically painful.  I put back the ARC and listen.  Within 30 seconds, the sound washes away the headache.  The solo sounds like a real guitar and not power drill.

 

I decide to try again with the Marantz but EQ it more towards what the ARC sounds like.  I bring the treble down to about 40% and the bass up to about 60%.  This sounds alright.  The fatigue is practically, if not completely, gone.  At this point, I'd guess most people would only hear a subtle difference between the two, but that difference is where the magic is.  While sounding better, it still didn't have the air or the width of the music through the ARC.  The holographic 3D sound is gone.  The realness is gone.  You have a, dare I say, good sounding amplifier but not great.  As I sat, sort of conflicted, I realized I had done actually what I sought out to do.  Tears for everyone.