MattyIceyo Posted June 12, 2020 Share Posted June 12, 2020 It's been a long time since I was active on this board and buying records all the time. Was wondering what everyone's take on the paypal policy of people asking for Friends and Family/Having the buyer pay the fees. Isn't the seller using the service? Wouldn't that be factored into the price? Also the difference is what 5% plus a small fee? I am sure I am going to come under fire this, but just wondering when the shift happens in transferring the fees to the buyer. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Out of Breath Records Posted June 12, 2020 Share Posted June 12, 2020 You send it as friend and family/gift and there's no fees paid if you have a PayPal account set up. Requires trust, but typically the community is pretty good. If the seller has feedback than it's a win/win most cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shenanigans Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 2 hours ago, MattyIceyo said: It's been a long time since I was active on this board and buying records all the time. Was wondering what everyone's take on the paypal policy of people asking for Friends and Family/Having the buyer pay the fees. Isn't the seller using the service? Wouldn't that be factored into the price? Also the difference is what 5% plus a small fee? I am sure I am going to come under fire this, but just wondering when the shift happens in transferring the fees to the buyer. Thanks! What shift? I think its pretty rare that sellers will ask for friends and family. I also generally just sell on discogs now so not even an option. If someone asks for friends and family I'll generally toss them the extra 3%. I prefer the protection unless I know who I'm buying from or it's someone I've dealt with before. daegor, Mars and Snaggle Von Swift 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N8TRU Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 I think it's wrong for any seller to ask the buyer to cover the fees in my opinion. They're saving a lot more than if they were using Amazon, Discogs or eBay. Just a greedy move imo. I've had people ask for friends and family but I'll never take the chance of getting burned over a couple extra dollars. HoneyFrosted, MattyIceyo, Mars and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyIceyo Posted June 13, 2020 Author Share Posted June 13, 2020 17 hours ago, N8TRU said: I think it's wrong for any seller to ask the buyer to cover the fees in my opinion. They're saving a lot more than if they were using Amazon, Discogs or eBay. Just a greedy move imo. I've had people ask for friends and family but I'll never take the chance of getting burned over a couple extra dollars. That's what I was trying to identify. 10 years ago I wouldn't think twice to put the charge to someone else. Just wrap that into the cost. You want 10 for something, charge 12. To be told "send it F&F so I get all the money" was just offensive to me. N8TRU 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daegor Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 (edited) I don't care how well I know someone as either the buyer or the seller, I want that PayPal protection. If I'm a seller I'll work it into the price, if I'm a buyer and they ask I'll ignore the request and send them an extra couple of bucks to cover the fee, fuck that. If something gets lost or damaged in the mail it's a huge pain in the ass without PayPal protection, as either the buyer or the seller. If someone is insisting on F&F it's hugely suspect. Edited June 13, 2020 by daegor Mars, shenanigans and ok. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyIceyo Posted June 14, 2020 Author Share Posted June 14, 2020 This was the barrage of messages I got and I almost cancelled the sale: "Awesome thanks! 5$ ship + 30$ = 35$ to (Email) thanks again! Please make sure your address is on there. I’m shipping today (I read that as: gimme the money ASAP). Also, please be sure to choose friends and family so I get the full 35$ and let me know when you've paid - thanks!" Now, I sent a couple of bucks extra of course. It is more the point. I should have to do that. Factor it into the price, or deal with losing the 60 cents or whatever it is. If you are that hard up for a dollar than I really dont know. Glad I am not totally crazy, Thanks daegor and N8TRU 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N8TRU Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 https://thefeecalculator.com/ I'm sure a lot of people know about it but this website is always a help. Snaggle Von Swift and daegor 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somethingvinyl Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 I typically only ask for people to pay friends/family when I don't know the person or they don't have an established presence on the boards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidney Crosley Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 I've found Paypal to be a bit of a pain in the ass even if you have to use their resolution centre - had to do this earlier in the year when I bought something not from a proper vendor, as it was a well disguised scam. In case you ever buy something properly, I learned the hard way that when you get sent the wrong product, let's say from China, Paypal wants you to pay to send it back to China with tracking, which is obviously ridiculous because the cost of tracked shipping is usually 10X the cost of the product - the sellers are banking on you not bothering to ship it back. Paypal will pay up to $30USD toward the cost of return shipping, but it's usually much more. Still, Paypal will want you to send it. The way around this is to let Paypal know that you were delivered an empty envelope/package. They won't force you to return nothing, and likely will be faster in resolving the case without you paying out of pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daegor Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 On 6/13/2020 at 9:37 PM, N8TRU said: https://thefeecalculator.com/ I'm sure a lot of people know about it but this website is always a help. Bookmarked! N8TRU 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shenanigans Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 On 6/13/2020 at 11:32 PM, somethingvinyl said: I typically only ask for people to pay friends/family when I don't know the person or they don't have an established presence on the boards. Sorry, but this is wrong. Paypal also offers protection for sellers as long as you follow their guidelines and it sounds like you're doing it so they can't file a claim in the case something happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shenanigans Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 3 hours ago, Sidney Crosley said: I've found Paypal to be a bit of a pain in the ass even if you have to use their resolution centre - had to do this earlier in the year when I bought something not from a proper vendor, as it was a well disguised scam. In case you ever buy something properly, I learned the hard way that when you get sent the wrong product, let's say from China, Paypal wants you to pay to send it back to China with tracking, which is obviously ridiculous because the cost of tracked shipping is usually 10X the cost of the product - the sellers are banking on you not bothering to ship it back. Paypal will pay up to $30USD toward the cost of return shipping, but it's usually much more. Still, Paypal will want you to send it. The way around this is to let Paypal know that you were delivered an empty envelope/package. They won't force you to return nothing, and likely will be faster in resolving the case without you paying out of pocket. You can just tell paypal that their $30 won't cover the cost of shipping and that it's not worth returning the product. I've done this a few times - once with a cheap record where the store sent me the wrong item and once where something I sent got a corner ding and the buyer complained. Paypal refunded out of their own pocket. I didn't know about the return shipping thing. I have to return an item and may look into filing a claim just so they pay for the shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somethingvinyl Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) On 6/15/2020 at 12:49 PM, shenanigans said: Sorry, but this is wrong. Paypal also offers protection for sellers as long as you follow their guidelines and it sounds like you're doing it so they can't file a claim in the case something happens. Paypal advertises that they protect the seller, but it just isn't the case universally. I have a personal experience where the buyer claimed he only received an empty box. I had no way to prove I didn't mail an empty box. So, fucked there. Plus I've heard enough horror stories from sellers to have this personal policy. There are some places here and FB groups where requesting the buyer to send goods & services is mandatory and I'm obligated to abide by that and I do. But if I get a random message from someone who discovers a thread of mine from a couple years ago and offers to buy a record, then I'm going to do what makes me feel comfortable. I get an email and conduct the business off the boards. Technically I possess the potential to screw the buyer by just taking the money and keeping the record. But why would I do that? It's not worth the money to tarnish a nearly perfect record of selling online since 2003. Someone coming in here and trashing a seller can hurt their business. I'm not going to do that. But I also am not going to leave myself open to be taken if I'm selling on my own space. Edited June 17, 2020 by somethingvinyl MattyIceyo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGhostOfRandySavage Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 On 6/16/2020 at 11:19 PM, somethingvinyl said: Paypal advertises that they protect the seller, but it just isn't the case universally. I have a personal experience where the buyer claimed he only received an empty box. I had no way to prove I didn't mail an empty box. So, fucked there. Plus I've heard enough horror stories from sellers to have this personal policy. There are some places here and FB groups where requesting the buyer to send goods & services is mandatory and I'm obligated to abide by that and I do. But if I get a random message from someone who discovers a thread of mine from a couple years ago and offers to buy a record, then I'm going to do what makes me feel comfortable. I get an email and conduct the business off the boards. Technically I possess the potential to screw the buyer by just taking the money and keeping the record. But why would I do that? It's not worth the money to tarnish a nearly perfect record of selling online since 2003. Someone coming in here and trashing a seller can hurt their business. I'm not going to do that. But I also am not going to leave myself open to be taken if I'm selling on my own space. Yeah, if the person isn't established on here as a buyer I can trust I ask for F&F. We had a rash of people on the board who would place tons of expensive orders with different folks all at once, and then claim they never got anything to get refunded while keeping the records. I've shown I can be trusted as a seller already, so why take the risk with some newjack? If it's someone I know from the boards or someone who has feedback from someone I know I'm comfortable with whatever price I set through the normal purchase option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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