Discogs Shipping/Billing Policy Change

[se7enstitches]

5 minutes ago, ZeroNowhere said:

If this eliminates people being able to order and then not pay until they feel like it, assuming they ever feel like it, then I’m all for it.  The minimum 4 day window to cancel when someone doesn’t pay is the dumbest shit ever.

AMEN to this. Buyers who take your stock offline for a weekend or longer are super rude. I usually make 2 attempts to get in touch and cancel the order after 2 days. These types of people always DM you later with some personal excuse you dont care about at all. I dont know you and dont want to hear it! I am at work!

[ZeroNowhere]

35 minutes ago, se7enstitches said:

AMEN to this. Buyers who take your stock offline for a weekend or longer are super rude. I usually make 2 attempts to get in touch and cancel the order after 2 days. These types of people always DM you later with some personal excuse you dont care about at all. I dont know you and dont want to hear it! I am at work!

I do the same thing, but cancel after 24 hours and state that I expect immediate payment in my seller terms.  You can’t buy shit on Amazon, Ebay, etc., hold up inventory, and then pay when and if you feel like it.  Why Discogs has it set up that way is beyond me.  Especially with new buyers who are typically the worst offenders.

[Oblivions]

Paying days later seems sort of like a generational thing. I can’t really imagine it in today’s world and I always wait until I have cash to pay and I pay instantly. But there are people who remember the days of waiting weeks for mail orders to arrive and paying by check/cash in an envelope and consider it reasonable to apply those timeframes and quirks to an immediate, accessible world.

[N8TRU]

Had a buyer today put the wrong address in for TX instead of CO. So they ended up paying TX tax specifically. They aren't required to change it or amend the order since we communicated but someone could very easily enter a state with no sales tax and then message the seller and say "hey sorry I put in the wrong state" and they can skip the tax. I live in DE so we don't have sales tax but I found this to be an interesting loophole.

[ZeroNowhere]

1 hour ago, Oblivions said:

Paying days later seems sort of like a generational thing. I can’t really imagine it in today’s world and I always wait until I have cash to pay and I pay instantly. But there are people who remember the days of waiting weeks for mail orders to arrive and paying by check/cash in an envelope and consider it reasonable to apply those timeframes and quirks to an immediate, accessible world.

It's pretty obvious with non-payment feedback that a lot of people are habitual offenders with ordering and not paying.  If being a pile of shit that can't pay for what was ordered is a generational thing, then sure, we'll use your excuse.  

Edited July 24, 2020 by ZeroNowhere

[mike]

4 hours ago, shenanigans said:

Tell me more about Pirate Ship? Upfront costs? What do I need? What's the catch!?

No catch. Just go on there and create an account. You only pay for what you buy. To get the simple export rate you just have to open the chat bubble and ask them to put it on your account (takes two seconds), then it'll show up as an option when picking your service. By far the cheapest international rates. 

[shenanigans]

9 minutes ago, mike said:

No catch. Just go on there and create an account. You only pay for what you buy. To get the simple export rate you just have to open the chat bubble and ask them to put it on your account (takes two seconds), then it'll show up as an option when picking your service. By far the cheapest international rates. 

Will check it out. Thanks

[Oblivions]

1 hour ago, ZeroNowhere said:

It's pretty obvious with non-payment feedback that a lot of people are habitual offenders with ordering and not paying.  If being a pile of shit that can't pay for what was ordered is a generational thing, then sure, we'll use your excuse.  

I’m referring more to people who pay but let the invoice sit for a few days. I’m also referring to sellers who welcome holds and are glad to let invoices sit for a week or more before canceling. It’s not purely generational but I anecdotally see it more amongst older collectors and old guard people who run shops. Anyway, as I said, I pay immediately and I let Discogs auto-cancel orders for me after their 4 day minimum. Discogs shoring up that clunky invoice step that allows for delayed payments is a good thing, IMO.

[Sad Heart]

Currently waiting on an order from a seller than I paid a week ago, that hasn’t even updated that they’ve received the payment, let alone have shipped it. Hoping policies help stuff like this too. If I did that to someone as a seller I know my ass would get yelled at / negative feedback. 

[shenanigans]

On 7/24/2020 at 2:52 PM, mike said:

No catch. Just go on there and create an account. You only pay for what you buy. To get the simple export rate you just have to open the chat bubble and ask them to put it on your account (takes two seconds), then it'll show up as an option when picking your service. By far the cheapest international rates. 

Checking this out now. I can put in first class international and it gives me a price. Is the simple export rate different?

[mike]

Yeah. Just gotta use the chat and ask for it and then it'll appear as an option. 

[shenanigans]

6 minutes ago, mike said:

Yeah. Just gotta use the chat and ask for it and then it'll appear as an option. 

Did it. About $7 cheaper for an LP to Canada. Thanks!

[mike]

Nice! 

[al-naafiysh]

This change is long overdue. Discogs always seemed antiquated in that you often had to commit to buy something with no idea how much the shipping would cost, leaving you at the mercy of the seller.

 

When you have some sellers charging $12 for international shipping, and some charging $27 to ship the same LP, it was always ridiculous that you had to ‘commit’ before ordering or send them a DM first and risk someone else buying. (Don’t get me started on how bad Discogs sellers are at responding to messages)

 

Regarding paying seller fees immediately, I think that’s the more contemporary way to do it - I know eBay still invoices, but most selling platforms just take it out immediately. The seller fees invoice seems like an unnecessary added step to me, they probably find themselves chasing down too many sellers whose payment methods bounce.

[streetwaves]

17 minutes ago, al-naafiysh said:

This change is long overdue. Discogs always seemed antiquated in that you often had to commit to buy something with no idea how much the shipping would cost, leaving you at the mercy of the seller.

 

 

 

When you have some sellers charging $12 for international shipping, and some charging $27 to ship the same LP, it was always ridiculous that you had to ‘commit’ before ordering or send them a DM first and risk someone else buying. (Don’t get me started on how bad Discogs sellers are at responding to messages)

 

 

 

Regarding paying seller fees immediately, I think that’s the more contemporary way to do it - I know eBay still invoices, but most selling platforms just take it out immediately. The seller fees invoice seems like an unnecessary added step to me, they probably find themselves chasing down too many sellers whose payment methods bounce.

 

Most often, shipping costs are listed in the seller's terms so I don't know why you wouldn't know how much they would charge.

[dnl]

5 hours ago, streetwaves said:

 

Most often, shipping costs are listed in the seller's terms so I don't know why you wouldn't know how much they would charge.

Many sellers just have "buyer pays shipping" in their terms without details. Ordering from European sellers has been a headache for me. A lot don't have any details regarding shipping to the US and require you to message them and hope they get back to you before the item sells.

[CeCeCe]

3 minutes ago, dnl said:

Ordering from European sellers has been a headache for me. A lot don't have any details regarding shipping to the US and require you to message them and hope they get back to you before the item sells.

Usually find that myself for most US sellers when I want something shipped to the UK, so I think its just most sellers regardless of where they are based!

[dnl]

3 hours ago, craigeduk said:

Usually find that myself for most US sellers when I want something shipped to the UK, so I think its just most sellers regardless of where they are based!

International shipping is the one thing I'm not sold on yet with these changes for sellers. Its difficult to predict the cost of shipping for orders of more than one item. I have automatic shipping prices already set and I sometimes end up refunding international orders because shipping was less than expected.

[daegor]

So the deadline is coming up.

 

I ship primarily internationally.  Canada Post constantly changes their rates.  The rates you can get a quote for ahead of time are often different than the price in the moment through PayPal.  AND PayPal offers Netparcel which is SOMETIMES 1/3 of the cost, sometimes on par, sometimes more.

My shipping policy right now quotes Canada Post for common destinations, but states in the terms that all quotes are estimates and that I'll update the cost when the order comes in.

It works well, I like it, my buyers seem to like it.  I don't do huge numbers by any means, but I probably have 1-6 orders a month?

Not sure what I'm going to do yet, the shipping policies are simply a nightmare for someone like me to set up, and I'd have to edit it 1-2 times a month to keep it accurate.  That's a lot of time I don't care to invest.

My Discogs sales only serve to fund my vinyl habit, so it's not big loss if I close up shop.  I'm thinking I may just let it ride, my understanding is that when Oct 1 rolls around Discogs will make all of my items unavailable since I don't have shipping policies set up.  I'm curious what percentage the market place will shrink, maybe it will be enough for them to come up with a better solution.

I also don't hate the idea of flat rate and offer a refund of the difference, but obviously people aren't going to be keen on that as a buyer.

[Velocity of Sound]

9 minutes ago, daegor said:

So the deadline is coming up.

 

I ship primarily internationally.  Canada Post constantly changes their rates.  The rates you can get a quote for ahead of time are often different than the price in the moment through PayPal.  AND PayPal offers Netparcel which is SOMETIMES 1/3 of the cost, sometimes on par, sometimes more.

My shipping policy right now quotes Canada Post for common destinations, but states in the terms that all quotes are estimates and that I'll update the cost when the order comes in.

It works well, I like it, my buyers seem to like it.  I don't do huge numbers by any means, but I probably have 1-6 orders a month?

Not sure what I'm going to do yet, the shipping policies are simply a nightmare for someone like me to set up, and I'd have to edit it 1-2 times a month to keep it accurate.  That's a lot of time I don't care to invest.

My Discogs sales only serve to fund my vinyl habit, so it's not big loss if I close up shop.  I'm thinking I may just let it ride, my understanding is that when Oct 1 rolls around Discogs will make all of my items unavailable since I don't have shipping policies set up.  I'm curious what percentage the market place will shrink, maybe it will be enough for them to come up with a better solution.

I also don't hate the idea of flat rate and offer a refund of the difference, but obviously people aren't going to be keen on that as a buyer.

I tried my best to set up the policy correctly and I’m still having a hard time getting it to say “complete”.  The backlash is SO FUCKING STRONG that I’m really hoping Discogs listens to their sellers and just stop the insanely. I only have 22 items listed for sale on Discogs, so I’ll move them to eBay if need be. Honestly, people spend more money on eBay anyway.  I’ll continue to catalog my collection on Discogs, but they can piss off as far as selling goes. 

[cesar11]

10 minutes ago, Velocity of Sound said:

Honestly, people spend more money on eBay anyway.  I’ll continue to catalog my collection on Discogs, but they can piss off as far as selling goes. 

This. I try to be as civil as I can be with the prices I put up but especially with these times, I'll sell out and go to eBay.

[mmhmm]

Took me like 5 minutes to set up my two shipping policies- United States and rest of the world. The shipping costs aren't completely fair to every country, but they're set at a rate I won't lose money on shipping. And now I won't have to deal with people constantly messaging me for a shipping quote. 

I may be oversimplifying this but it doesn't seem crazy complex (as a U.S.-based seller). 

 

[al-naafiysh]

4 minutes ago, mmhmm said:

Took me like 5 minutes to set up my two shipping policies- United States and rest of the world. The shipping costs aren't completely fair to every country, but they're set at a rate I won't lose money on shipping. And now I won't have to deal with people constantly messaging me for a shipping quote. 

I may be oversimplifying this but it doesn't seem crazy complex (as a U.S.-based seller). 

 

I agree. It seems like a necessary step to have Discogs function by the same rules as every other marketplace on the internet. Having to message first and wait for a shipping quote is pretty antiquated in 2020 - everywhere else, it is the seller's responsibility to figure out general shipping rates so that they don't lose money. Sometimes they're a little high, sometimes they're a little low; it generally cancels out

 

(and I say this as an occasional seller, currently figuring out those rates)

[ZeroNowhere]

38 minutes ago, mmhmm said:

Took me like 5 minutes to set up my two shipping policies- United States and rest of the world. The shipping costs aren't completely fair to every country, but they're set at a rate I won't lose money on shipping. And now I won't have to deal with people constantly messaging me for a shipping quote. 

I may be oversimplifying this but it doesn't seem crazy complex (as a U.S.-based seller). 

 

Same.  I set one up quite a while back and it has been a huge time saver.  I only ship in the US, but even so, it saves me from having to invoice people and then hope they see it and pay.  

[daegor]

I can see this working well if you're US based, but unfortunately in Canada (and lots of other countries) shipping rates can vary wildly and change constantly.

A problem with setting a flat rate high enough to cover that variance is that puts you lower down in the list when sellers sort by Price: Lowest compared to others who have a properly set rate.

 

1 hour ago, al-naafiysh said:

It seems like a necessary step to have Discogs function by the same rules as every other marketplace on the internet.

The problem is that it's only a half-step.  Every other place on the internet you enter your address and it figures out the shipping cost.  Discogs isn't doing this, instead making the sellers figure out the rates themselves.  It seems like the majority of people are just going with the flat rate option, which actually hurts the buyers since most will be paying more for shipping now.

 

If they had ACTUALLY implemented a solution instead of just forcing sellers to figure it out on their own this would be great.  Unfortunately it's just a step further AWAY from being able to compete with every other marketplace.