Being Veg Is Worse For Animals Than Eating Them

[hipsterasfolk]

[riddle350]

On a personal and opinionated level, I think that not eating meat as way of protest or to express care for animals in general is a weak reason to risk your health and guide your life. By risk your health I am speaking of vegetarians I have known that know nothing of eating healthy and live on a diet of french fries, potato chips and mozzarella sticks.

I think vegetarians should either commit or get off the fucking fence but aside from that, please don't compare vegans to idiots who know nothing about nutrition. People who eat a proper vegan diet are vastly healthier than those that do not. People who live off french fries, potato chips and mozzarella sticks are just fucking stupid.

[steventangent]

I resent vegetarians/vegans for turning food into something ideological. I'm gonna eat whatever the hell I want.

I view eating meat and using animal products to be just as much as an ideology as being vegetarian/vegan. Non vegans love to paint us as militant where as I would use the word passionate to describe our, at least my, position. Non vegans get incredibly defensive about food/lifestyle politics because really they have to be. It's the only way for them to not feel guilty. If you consume animal products you have to recognize that you are selfish. You have to be comfortable with the fact that your actions result in the death of sentient beings. Your actions damage the environment. Your actions harm your health. Eat/consume whatever you please but don't parade around as if you're innocent. Own up to what you do.

From the makers of White Guilt and Liberal Guilt comes new Omnivore Guilt!

[steventangent]

And really, dude, everyone's actions damage the environment, and nobody - that is, not.a.single.person. - is "innocent" in the slightest of anything. If you want to talk about a matter of degree, then yes, in the matter of animal exploitation and unsustainable farming practices, meat consumers are probably mostly relatively worse than your average vegan. But even lobbing such an accusation from any one group of people to another is just the pot calling the kettle black in my book.

Or, put another way, it's time for everyone to admit they're a fucking hypocrite and keep their goddamn shit to themselves.

And it's time for every group and everyone to stop pretending we were ever "innocent."

This isn't really directed to any one person here, so don't nobody go taking offense now.

[lonesomexloveus]

LETS BE HONEST HERE, GUYS. i don't like chickens. they freak me the hell out. i eat a lot of chicken and fish, because while fish don't freak me out like chickens do, they're not cute and cuddly like cows. which i don't eat.

i don't like enough vegetables/non-meat protein rich foods to safely be a vegan/vegetarian. i enjoy eating soy based 'meat' products from time to time, and i like to bake solely vegan if at all possible.

most of you know i'm straight edge, but i'm not gonna go on some tirade about how all people who drink and/or smoke are destroying this world with their potential alcoholism, drunk driving, and all the carcinogens they're spewing into the air.

going on a rant about how meat-eaters are destroying the environment etc etc is utterly ridiculous, in my opinion. the vast majority of things we buy/consume are probably made in factories spewing god knows what into the environment, so yeah, what steven said.

also, more power to anyone who is vegan and sticks to it. that shit is hard. i don't have time to read and analyze that many labels on food.

also ALSO, just curious; how do the vegans here feel about honey? i've heard both sides of the argument.

[GradedOnACurve]

how do the vegans here feel about honey? i've heard both sides of the argument.

This always intrigued me as well. Don't understand why some vegans won't eat honey...

[Team Avatar]

I've never heard a vegan argue pro honey.

People always give me shit about honey, asking why I don't eat it? The answer is simply - "I don't eat animal products/by-products'. Then they start explaining that insects aren't animals, so I have to explain that kevin put condom on for great sex.

[lonesomexloveus]

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/food/2008/07/the_great_vegan_honey_debate.html

i have respect for people who have the discipline to be vegan, i just don't understand it entirely.

[Team Avatar]

I read/skimmed most of the article, but does it actually have an argument as to why vegan's eat honey?

[lonesomexloveus]

eh, according to the author, honeybees are only a very small percentage of the actual beekeeping industry, and 'commercial bees are used in the production of about 100 foods, including almonds, avocados, broccoli, canola, cherries, cucumbers, lettuce, peaches, pears, plums, sunflowers, and tomatoes.' supposedly they have much harder lives than those used to make honey.

SO. some vegans argue that if you follow the hard-line argument to the extreme, you can't really eat any of those products, and your diet becomes insanely restrictive.

[almightyseancore]

Let's all agree on one thing - there'd be less methane in the air if we switched from cows to kangaroos, so we should do that.

there'd be less methane in the air if there werent so many damn humans.

we should all kill ourselves.

[BuzzersonKillwell]

Let's all agree on one thing - there'd be less methane in the air if we switched from cows to kangaroos, so we should do that.

there'd be less methane in the air if there werent so many damn humans.

we should all kill ourselves.

This is my take as well. The most ethical thing to do is to starve yourself to death.

[Team Avatar]

I don't think there is anything unethical, or wrong with killing an animal for food. Where I don't support recreational hunting, I am okay with someone hunting one animal, say a deer, and then eating it that night/the next, etc.

The business of raising animals solely to be slaughtered, preserved, and sold is wrong, in my opinion.

in other words, the animals will revolt one day and kill all meat eaters.

[towniecore]

It's funny how the two extremes can get so preachy with each other. You've got Vegans/Vegetarians who love to proclaim the goodness of their bean/tofu patty impostor meat creations and then the meataholics who counter everything by expressing the need for MORE BACON.

I could care less what other people are eating, however I do know that the body is a machine and it needs a combination of animal products, and plant life to thrive. There was a point in human history where we were required to lift heavy shit and run really fast (along with sitting on our asses for long periods of time) and it needed proper fuel to do so. Today's society makes it very easy to forget that. When yous top testing your body and making it stronger it can become very vulnerable.

We can all agree that the standard western diet is fucked. To counter this, I feel like people need to stop worrying about being totally vegan or one of the dudes from Epic Meal time and worry more about all of the processed man-made shit they're shoveling in their faces everyday. Do all of your grocery shopping on the outside rim of the store and buy REAL food. Put down the box of Eggos and pick up some Omega 3 enriched eggs. Meat, Vegetables, Fruits, Nuts, and Seeds, there's your guidelines. If man altered or added something to it, probably best to stay away.

I definitely am not on board with the unethical slaughtering and cultivation of animals and try to avoid products associated with that whenever I can. It is totally possible to buy meats that do not come from some sort of tortured or oppressed animal. Look for grass fed meats or meats from local butchers. Meat is here for us to eat just as much as broccoli or cashews. And as far as the cute and cuddly stuff, I can genuinely say from experience on a ranch that farm animals are not cute or cuddly. They're mean, dumb, and totally covered in shit. Seriously, walk up close to any Cow, there is a 1 inch thick crust of shit covering their entire bodies.

Please excuse the rant, but food is something I'm pretty passionate about. I'vestuck to eating REAL food for quite a while now and have been able to not get sick, run faster, lift heaver, and look better than prior to cleaning up my diet. People should not restrict their diets based on misinformed ideologies but rather on what will keep them healthiest.

[Team Avatar]

How do you know that the body needs a combination of animal products and plant life?

There is no unbiased research done that suggests this. Take a country like India, where over 25% of the population is completely vegan. They've been vegan for hundreds of years due to their religious beliefs.

[jerseydave77]

I could care less what other people are eating, however I do know that the body is a machine and it needs a combination of animal products, and plant life to thrive.

I've been Vegetarian since 1995 - I've done centurian bicycle rides, volunteer as a firefighter in my community, work 12 hour days and along with my wife raise our son who doesn't sleep enough. If I'm not thriving without meat then I don't know how to define it.

[lonesomexloveus]

it sounds like he's mistakenly replacing 'protein' with 'meat/animal products'.

as long as you're getting enough lean protein, it doesn't really matter if it's from an animal or not.

[towniecore]

How do you know that the body needs a combination of animal products and plant life?

There is no unbiased research done that suggests this. Take a country like India, where over 25% of the population is completely vegan. They've been vegan for hundreds of years due to their religious beliefs.

Strictly my opinion. I agree, there's no definite study proving either way.

I could care less what other people are eating, however I do know that the body is a machine and it needs a combination of animal products, and plant life to thrive.

I've been Vegetarian since 1995 - I've done centurian bicycle rides, volunteer as a firefighter in my community, work 12 hour days and along with my wife raise our son who doesn't sleep enough. If I'm not thriving without meat then I don't know how to define it.

I should have been more clear on that. I was relating thrive more to athleticism and performance. Mainly looking at diets of pro athletes. Once again though, strictly opinion, no studies to back it up. Congrats on your accomplishments.

[towniecore]

it sounds like he's mistakenly replacing 'protein' with 'meat/animal products'.

as long as you're getting enough lean protein, it doesn't really matter if it's from an animal or not.

Negative, meat is necessary for the fatty acids just as much as they are for protein.

[lonesomexloveus]

it sounds like he's mistakenly replacing 'protein' with 'meat/animal products'.

as long as you're getting enough lean protein, it doesn't really matter if it's from an animal or not.

Negative, meat is necessary for the fatty acids just as much as they are for protein.

you can get fatty acids from many foods other than meat:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_nutrition#Omega-3_fatty_acids

[Team Avatar]

I've been Vegetarian since 1995 - I've done centurian bicycle rides, volunteer as a firefighter in my community, work 12 hour days and along with my wife raise our son who doesn't sleep enough. If I'm not thriving without meat then I don't know how to define it.

I should have been more clear on that. I was relating thrive more to athleticism and performance. Mainly looking at diets of pro athletes. Once again though, strictly opinion, no studies to back it up. Congrats on your accomplishments.

There are many famous athletes who don't eat meat. It's definitely not the majority, but they do exist and succeed.

For example, Carl Lewis, Bill Walton, Tony Gonzalez.

[mediocore]

There are many famous athletes who don't eat meat. It's definitely not the majority, but they do exist and succeed.

For example, Carl Lewis, Bill Walton, Tony Gonzalez.

And now let's compare them to a few meat-eaters: Tim Tebow, Ryan Leaf, Matt Leinart.

Clear advantage? Vegetarians.

[mcm1610]

I resent vegetarians/vegans for turning food into something ideological. I'm gonna eat whatever the hell I want.

I view eating meat and using animal products to be just as much as an ideology as being vegetarian/vegan. Non vegans love to paint us as militant where as I would use the word passionate to describe our, at least my, position. Non vegans get incredibly defensive about food/lifestyle politics because really they have to be. It's the only way for them to not feel guilty. If you consume animal products you have to recognize that you are selfish. You have to be comfortable with the fact that your actions result in the death of sentient beings. Your actions damage the environment. Your actions harm your health. Eat/consume whatever you please but don't parade around as if you're innocent. Own up to what you do.

Well I flat out disagree with this. We (or at least I do) get "defensive" because we're eating what people have eaten for thousands of years and now we're being told that it's wrong by holier-than-thou vegans. I don't really give a shit what anyone eats, but if you're going to get in my face about eating chicken or beef, fuck off.

[booyahachieved]

Bill Clinton is vegan and that's all I need to know.

[towniecore]

Negative, meat is necessary for the fatty acids just as much as they are for protein.

you can get fatty acids from many foods other than meat:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian_nutrition#Omega-3_fatty_acids

Agreed, however you need to consider the ratio of these Omega 3 fats to calories. You consume a far greater amount of calories eating walnuts to get the same amount of omega 3 as found in a filet of salmon. Eating like this will make you gain weight. The same ratio approach applies with protein. To get the same amount of protein a lean chicken breast has to offer you would need to consume a much greater amount of calories worth of beans.