codeine Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Okay so I'm leaning toward refunding a transaction, dude bought a rare, pretty expensive record through Discogs, Signed up same day he bought it, checked out w/o even asking a shipping price and then was fine w/ the $17 int'l cost. I invoiced him, and he said he tried to pay but he was unable, I've bought a bit off Discogs, but not sold much yet, so I'm not sure if this can actually happen, but it never happened to me when buying.But just in case I sent another invoice, he said the same thing plus he called paypal and that they told him I'd have to invoice him manually, so I did this through pp and he said he couldn't pay cause his transaction was flagged, so he called pp again, they told him the transaction was flagged at random, not cause there was anything wrong with either account.I said forget the invoice just use 'send money' and make sure to send as payment for goods and I would cover the fees. The money appeared but he sent it as a gift, and said via email that's the only way it would work and asked me to cancel the invoice I'd sent.Is this even possible? Dude had no feedback so I was thinking of chipping an extra $4 just to get tracking but I don't think tracking is even any good if he claims unauthorized transaction. I do *not* want to be out the record and the money. Thinking of just refunding the guy, so I sent him an email explaining that I might have to issue a refund because paying as a gift does not provide seller protection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellnow Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 The whole thing seems odd but doesn't sound like a scam. A paypal gift does not provide protection to the seller OR the buyer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jase Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 He sent it as a gift, dude obviously wants the record. He has absolutely no recourse for any action he takes once you send it. Also, if you even decided to just keep the money, he couldn't do jack about it. Don't do that though, that's a cunt move. And you don't want to be a cunt batnoises, moonbeams and horrorshow696 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeine Posted June 18, 2013 Author Share Posted June 18, 2013 Could be wrong, but I think even though there is no buyer protection for him and he can't make the 45-day limit paypal claim, I believe he can claim to paypal that it was an unauthorized transaction and since there is also no seller protection for me, get a refund.If that is not the case, then there is no question. I should call paypal tomorrow and ask them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jase Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Nope, there is straight no protection. If it was through PayPal via credit card, as a gift. To get the money back he'd have to contact his CC company, and they'd likely still not refund it. As it stands, you are in a good position to not be scammed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeine Posted June 18, 2013 Author Share Posted June 18, 2013 Hm, okay. That's reassuring to hear. I'll probably still call and ask just to be 100% sure and for future reference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokimedo Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 im an admin on blink 182 message board and this dude that posted on their sold a giant blink bunny to a guy in belgium, the guy sent him the money via gift on paypal, he sent the bunny, and then the guy got his money back somehow, even though it was sent as a gift. so yeah...theres def still ways you can be scammed. he got scammed out of like $800. http://blink-182online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/39762-update-blink-bunny-has-been-purchased/page-30 ts the chargeback scam.Buyer buys item, buyer gets item, buyer tells bank item was bought with stolen credit card or somesuch - basically without the cardholder's permission, bank reverses payment, paypal gets money back from payment from seller, buyer gets items for nothing, seller fumes with impotent rage.Its in paypal's terms and conditions that the seller is liable for the buyer not using a stolen credit card. Ridiculous I know.You wont get the money back. moonbeams 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardacus Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 im an admin on blink 182 message board and this dude that posted on their sold a giant blink bunny to a guy in belgium, the guy sent him the money via gift on paypal, he sent the bunny, and then the guy got his money back somehow, even though it was sent as a gift. so yeah...theres def still ways you can be scammed. he got scammed out of like $800. http://blink-182online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/39762-update-blink-bunny-has-been-purchased/page-30 Wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esbe Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 im an admin on blink 182 message board and this dude that posted on their sold a giant blink bunny to a guy in belgium, the guy sent him the money via gift on paypal, he sent the bunny, and then the guy got his money back somehow, even though it was sent as a gift. so yeah...theres def still ways you can be scammed. he got scammed out of like $800. http://blink-182online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/39762-update-blink-bunny-has-been-purchased/page-30 Good to know! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiatorhums Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 I'd say make a phone call to PayPal and possibly look through some of their policies. Better to be out a couple hours of research than the record. I would say if you still have doubts afterwards, refund the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beags Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 "Buyer buys item, buyer gets item, buyer tells bank item was bought with stolen credit card or somesuch - basically without the cardholder's permission, bank reverses payment, paypal gets money back from payment from seller, buyer gets items for nothing, seller fumes with impotent rage." I own a retro video game store on eBay and this happened to me I sold a game for $150 and about 3 months afterwards paypal called me and informed me that the game had been purchased by someone using a stolen credit card. HOWEVER, had i sent the item with sign-on-arrival registered post, i would've been able to keep the funds as i had proof that it had been sent by me and arrived at the other end, and been signed for. Unforunately i sent it with regular tracking without signature, so i didnt, and i was out of pocket $150. Sucks, but i've learnt a lesson, albeit the hard way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stickman31 Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Refund him. If he's not going to pay the right way don't have him pay at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rooks Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 What this guy said. Paypal is not an overly complicated service. You can pay the right way, or fuck off! Refund him. If he's not going to pay the right way don't have him pay at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhulud Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Never sell International. Problem solved. psus2h 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somethingvinyl Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Signature confirmation on expensive items is necessary! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youspinmeround Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 I have been selling items on discogs and just of late internationally. I only sell to people with feedback and numerous transactions. Too many people signing up on that site and buying stuff the first day they register for stuff that is generally available. Make we weary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeine Posted June 18, 2013 Author Share Posted June 18, 2013 Well it's Canada to USA so if I never sold int'l I'd be cutting my sales in half, easily.Thanks for the responses guys, very helpful. What Toki said, that's what I was afraid of... I kept wondering why 1 person was having so much trouble just paying an invoice. I was thinking either paypal flagged their account, or possibly there was some kind of loophole they are looking to exploit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seku Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Never sell International. Problem solved. This is definitely dick move! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
souljacker8888 Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 i will say in the buyers defense, paypal has caused me crazy problems with paying for simple transactions and invoices before. tied to send money, wouldnt let me. had person send me an invoice, couldn't pay it. wanted to check past transaction, account locked out... one of the worst was having my account locked until I gave the answer to whatever stupid question I chose 7 or 8 years ago and had never again gave a second thought too. No matter how many ways I tried to enter the name of my first grade teacher, I could not send a simple payment! After spending a couple days of email and then getting my phone call bumped up to supervisor they said they would send me a link to completely reset my account so I could use it. Link never came. All to send $25 bucks (to myself none the less). A few months later I tied to use the account to pay an online retailer and worked with no problems. Some funky shit there sometimes. that being said, i was one of the 'refund the money' voters... simply because I of it being hard to be covered due to lack of good overseas tracking methods! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pukebileforever Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Refund that shit knocka. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shenanigans Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 Since when was signature confirmation necessary? I thought you only needed delivery conf? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konk Posted June 18, 2013 Share Posted June 18, 2013 This is why the strip club doesn't take American Express. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeine Posted June 18, 2013 Author Share Posted June 18, 2013 Got off the horn w/ paypal, they told me it could be any number of reasons why he was unable to pay the invoice, but it could be that they hadn't used their account for a year. Also found out it's more risky for the buyer to pay as a gift, but they still suggested sending it with tracking so that I have proof I sent it, if I decide not to refund it. They said that if he makes a claim it will automatically be closed in the seller's favour. If they pay using a credit card through paypal they can make the claim through their credit card company, though. And I think the way they get their money back is by using the credit card and then after they receive the item, they claim the card had been stolen, hence the unauthorized transaction thing.So now I'm leaning more towards sending the record but going deluxe on tracking/delivery confirmation/signature. At least since he paid as a gift there's an extra couple bucks on my end to put towards shipping via a tracked method, and this way it should get there a bit faster to make up for the hold-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konk Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I thought the mailing address had to match the credit card's mailing address. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeine Posted June 19, 2013 Author Share Posted June 19, 2013 To qualify for seller protection yeah. But he has no buyer protection either from sending as a gift. Oh wait... yeah you mean the address I'm shipping the record to will match his cc billing address and that will prove that it was authorized? I guess it would. So he still wanted me to send it, rather than a refund, so I decided I'm going to send it with delivery confirmation, so I'll have proof that I sent it. I'll also save the emails in case they could come in handy if problems arise, but I think it will be cool, dude seems to really just want the record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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