Do any of you actually listen to the music you buy?

[moonbeams]

That means you open it up and you play it and are able to hear it. I was looking at some albums today, not that long till they're out and others only just out in the last few months and not only do I see terms like sold out and limited and varients but I see people doing trades. Then I browse the very few music forums I bother with including this one and I see these same terms and what I did was I looked at these albums that have sold out in just a few months and also to the ones coming out and it's the same kind of thing. This one will be numbered, this one will be red but this other black varient is only 1000 copies.

 

 

Really? Is that what music is now? That to me means it's shit. How can any company or label with a straight face say they care about the music they are releasing when they stick a number on each one, different colours on each one and then places like this talk about it so you end up with all these people buying the damn things just for the sake of it having it as a collectable. Don't get me wrong, if i owned a label, i'd take every penny I could get out of all you people. You deserve to have your money taken out of your pocket, you deserve to be ripped off, you deserve to pay $30 for a piece of cheap PVC plastic stuck inside some cheap cardboard cover. If i was them I'd do the same damned thing because obviously hand written numbers and colours and limited pressings means more than buying something because you want it and it's going to give you pleasure to listen to it.

 

 

I applaud the bootleggers. I wish they would do more. Paragon done some great bootlegs over the last few years with regards to 12" singles. What we need is more bootleggers to start pressing albums and sell them fast and cheap. Let's face it, major labels are just gonna stick the same CD master onto the record anyway, it's not like they're gonna spend any time making sure Katy Perry sounds good on vinyl so I think we need to go back to the 1990s where the white label was king and you all know that anyway. You know the albums you buy from Amazon are just as good as any bootleg, you fool yourselves into believing you're getting something better but it really isn't. I'd rather that than be told there is only 1000 copies of an album being pressed but oh no....that's just a colour, if you want it on black vinyl well, you're screwed cause that sold out in so many hours but don't worry you can still buy some on white vinyl from this cowboy website in America and pay lots of shipping on top of the premium price because remember it's limited!  We could easily press 5 or 6000 of them but we'd rather fuck you up the ass and get what we can while we can. What an insult to me and my fellow music fans.

 

 

It's all money money money. Anytime i read the word varient or hand numbered or limited I will think of the word money because that's all it is about. And don't any of you lot think I'm on your side, I told you people not that long ago it was your fault for killing off the 7" and 12" single and now through sheer greed and ignorance you're starting to kill off the album LP. Shame on all of you that buy into all this hype and talk and throw your money at these money hungry labels. And you can badmouth me all you want like you tried to do last time because I mentioned I liked popular music and this place thrives on guitar driven music and lets sit barefoot singing a song about love and peace and the thing is, at least with my music, i don't need a million options, I don't need money taken from my bank account months in advance because some geek who has more money than sense decides to dive in and buy it for the sake of making a quick buck rather than giving it to me, someone who actually wants it for the right reasons. When Eminem's MMLP2 gets released in a few weeks, and it will be on vinyl in the UK, no word on the US yet. At least I know i can not only buy it on release but I can buy it at Christmas, next year even, maybe next Christmas or Christmas 2015 because real labels don't just pick a number out of thin air, they keep pressing them and keep making them available to suit the demand. It's like the 100,000 copies of Justin Timberlake's 20/20 album. Those copies will last years. That's how it should be done. Infact I don't even want any replies in this thread, I just had to get that off my chest and let you people know what I think and what I think is right, I'm always right so don't try and argue back at me because you know I'm right and I don't care what the excuses are, It's BS and it ruins the very thought of buying a musical album. Music was never about that and it should never be about that.No one should ever have to feel pressured about buying an album because oh no if you don't buy it now then you can't later. All this stuff about colours is rubbish too, no coloured vinyl was ever superior to black virgin vinyl. Hand numbering? That's fine as long as you keep making them, you don't just stop after a certain number, if the demand is there then you keep going, you don't force people onto Ebay or Discogs. Or you do what the big labels do, you press plenty and you do it on black vinyl and you ship it everywhere you can.

 

First off, sympathies to you for writing a long post and lazy people coming in and saying "too many words" as if 2 minutes of consecutive reading is too difficult for them (probably is).

 

However, your argument is as consistent as slimy diarrhea and here's why.

 

You mention (sic) "varients" (the actual spelling is variant) and low press runs. Variants started as a way to reward or motivate early buyers (or direct from label sales), but they have indeed gotten out of hand with the VC generation. Its a cash grab when there are 4 colors pressed at once. But a lot of records are repressed on different colors. So you might complain that the repressings are cashgrabs and you're wrong here.

 

Record pressings have limited runs because smart labels don't want to press more than they can sell. It's better for a label to sell out of a limited run than to be stuck with inventory taking up warehouse space.

 

What you don't understand is that most of the record labels that have been putting out records all through the digital age are smaller, independently run labels. They press how many they can sell. Anything else is bad business.

 

VC has changed a lot over the past year and I'm no longer familiar with this place. But I could tell you that everyone who posted here 2 years ago listened to their records.

 

Also, bootlegging? Get real. The reason most people here buy records is because it sounds better. I've never heard a good sounding bootleg because they're not made from the original masters, they're made from copies, either digital or cassette taped records. Or they're made from molds.

[HoneyFrosted]

Wait wait wait, hold on. People are trying to make MONEY off of making limited presses and color variants??! No fucking shit.

Even though vinyl sales are on the steady increase, people still need to know they're going to make a profit from pressing records. This is one way to do it while pleasing the fans. I see no problem. It's not a requirement to buy these things. I'm inconvenienced in a really minor way when the only presses of certain albums are special over-the-top editions (an easy example to point to that's discussed here are the early Circa Survive records) but it doesn't matter in the long run. A great majority of Circa fans would buy a plain black repress of those albums and love it to death. If people want to hunt down other variants, let them. The reason doesn't matter much.

 

 

For intelligent conversation, visit this board:

 

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/forums/music-corner.2/

 

Bye.

 

At first glance, it looks like nobody on that board has listened to music made in the last 20 years.

[Bladewillisisdead]

I can't actually finish reading this thread all I can say is

 

[scentofdeath]

I get what the OP is saying, and for the most part he's right.

 

Labels, and even bands are getting cheeky with vinyl pressings exactly because they now most record buyers today are obsessive compulsive. Take for example the recent Opeth reissue of Ghost Reveries - they put them up for pre-sale a variant or two every couple of days saying they're limited to what ever but never disclosing the full range of variants. Thus triggering every buyer with a compulsion (that's 99 percent or them) to refreshing the store page every 10 minutes for a week and to buy all possible variants. And that's the buyer's problem, I don't care what they do with their money, but the attitude of a band / label towards the very people who support and purchase their music, is completely despicable. And by that I mean the lack of transparency and good faith regarding an in demand and sought after LP, because they know all too well, don't they?  

[Tommy]

I think we can assume crazybeats has a second account lol

 

hahaha - spilled my drink reading this

[rcafilm]

This is simultaneously my favorite and least favorite thread.


FWIW: To me, listening to records is a treat. I mostly listen to music via MP3s/WAVs on my computer, so listening to records is kind of an event for me. I love the physicality. People who bitch about anyone who cares about anything other than the music itself when it comes to vinyl will always be wrong to me, because, in my mind, vinyl is about the physical, visual, and aural all together. The OP seems to have a vendetta against colored vinyl because it's supposedly a money-making gimmick for collectors. Personally, I love colored vinyl because it adds to the experience. I love seeing a release with awesome color variants that compliment the album artwork or reflect the mood of the music. As far as limited pressings, I'll agree, they can get a little ridiculous. But as someone else mentioned, a lot of the music being put out on vinyl today is pressed by small record companies who can't afford a 100,000 unit pressing. They press 500 because they know they can sell 500. That's how business works. And yes, they are out to make money. Everyone's got bills to pay and hobbies (like, you know, owning records or something silly like that) to spend on. Do I care about having a limited pressing of a record? A little bit. There's something special about knowing that only 99 other people in the world have the same thing you have. It adds to the special connection that vinyl gives me to the music. Do I go out of my way to get the rarest variant? Hell no. But hey, one thing that I've noticed on this board is that everybody enjoys vinyl in different ways and for different reasons. Do some of the reasons seem a little stupid? Sure. Is that going to stop me from enjoying my records? Nope.

TL;DR- fuckally'allz.gif

[dnsnlsn]

hahaha - spilled my drink reading this

wtf why

[Tommy]

Laughed so hard because I was thinking the same exact thing. This thread has been a great read, one of the best in a while. I'm still baffled that this guy continued the conversation after he said this:

 

Infact I don't even want any replies in this thread, I just had to get that off my chest and let you people know what I think and what I think is right, I'm always right so don't try and argue back at me because you know I'm right and I don't care what the excuses are

[monsterrod]

This thread needs more Shaq.

[astrangerwithcandy]

Ho-ly-fuck. Is this the apocapips?

[isavedlatin54]

I saw Carrie tonight (snore fest) and I come home to this... Also more shaq gifs.

[isavedlatin54]

After reading this. I don't think anyone taught The OP simple economics.

[chamb117]

After reading this. I don't think anyone taught The OP simple economics.

 

who needs economics when you have varients

[isavedlatin54]

who needs economics when you have varients

Touché my friend.

[batman]

This thread needs more Shaq.

 

 

I saw Carrie tonight (snore fest) and I come home to this... Also more shaq gifs.

[edgedestroys]

hey op can you do this with your records??????????

 

 

didn't think so

 

[batman]

[vialister]

The very first thing I saw after clicking that link was a thread titled "Best use of cowbell in a rock song..." 

 

If there was one thing I wish I could take back in my life, it would be clicking that link. 

[soundboard]

To the OP:

 

You must have been the dude in high school that would jump up and down on chicken or hamburger day complaining about chicken being available as well instead of just hamburgers because they sold out before you could get your burger...and that just isn't fair. You'd yell and scream: "Why don't they just cook all the hamburgers in the world so I can have one right now?"

 

[slinch]

Real music fans =  Sound quality > Everything else

 

I totally get you, your crosley must be giving you mad soundz.

[Guest crazybeats]

hey op can you do this with your records??????????

 

 

didn't think so

 

 

 

 

Can I do that? I wouldn't dream of doing that. No music fan in their right mind would put their vinyl records on a duvet or any surface like that. But then again it's not about listening to them with you is it? No it's just about collecting so you don't mind leaving them lying on some duvet covered in hairs and dirt do you. Place is rife with Americans, typical big mouth ones too, that's what you lot have more than anything and in the real world you wouldn't say any of that stuff to me because you know i'd bitch slap all of you across the face with the back of my hand. You're better just sticking to your gifs.

[eight1echo]

no gif no read

[soundboard]

Can I do that? I wouldn't dream of doing that. No music fan in their right mind would put their vinyl records on a duvet or any surface like that. But then again it's not about listening to them with you is it? No it's just about collecting so you don't mind leaving them lying on some duvet covered in hairs and dirt do you. Place is rife with Americans, typical big mouth ones too, that's what you lot have more than anything and in the real world you wouldn't say any of that stuff to me because you know i'd bitch slap all of you across the face with the back of my hand. You're better just sticking to your gifs.

Uh oh tough guy who hates American's. Yes half of us probably would say this stuff to you. We're American's we all got Iron Patriot suits after Iron Man 3 so we can pretty much do what we want.

 

Anyway less talk about beating up people who don't agree with you and more talk about vinyl. That's what we're here for.

[Guest crazybeats]

All the brave talk as usual. That's the applie pie and coca cola talking buddy. Turn your Bruce Springsteen records down and come back to reality with the rest of us.

[AlexH.]

God damn, you will not quit.

 

 

Well what do you think it costs for them to get those 7" records made? How much do these other labels pay for each 12" album? Let's talk about that for a second. When we see talk of 1000 records and so many are black and so many red and so many mixed and they have the nice jacket. How much do you think they pay to get that made? What is the cost of one record? I remember back in 2007 I was told by someone who worked in wholesale that Universal Music distribution sold 12" singles at a wholesale cost of $1.50. It never went any lower. Now back then, I don't care what the record sales show.......vinyl was big. Labels churned them out every few weeks and that was just the promos, that wasn't the retail versions and it was an amazing time for a music fan  but my point is they obviously got better rates due to the volume they were producing and Universal did that for many many many labels. But what always got me was they were in charge of a lot of albums too and I always wondered what the cost of the albums were wholesale. If they were doing 12" singles for $1.50...they must have made a decent profit on that $1.50 to begin with, regardless of what the person at the other end was selling them for.

 

According to United's price calculator: 1000 standard weight black LPs in generic DJ sleeves cost $2.09 per unit. If you're only pressing 500, it's $2.82/unit. According to Gotta Groove's price card: $2.20/unit for 1000, $3.10/unit for 500, and that's with no sleeves at all. Other plants' prices are roughly in line with those. That's without premastering, full cover labels, non-generic jackets (gatefold jackets can cost as much as the records themselves) recording costs, and having enough money left over to keep the label's lights on/dump into the next project. I hope this thread doesn't exist just because a guy told you in 2007 that Universal sold 12" singles for $1.50 wholesale. They were that cheap because:

 

1. It was 2007, and I don't care that you think vinyl was big, the record sales show it wasn't. Digital sales were in their infancy, CDs were still king, and vinyl was for nerds, old fogeys, and DJs. Now, post-"vinyl revival", post-Jack White, post-Record Store Day, pressing plants are slammed 24/7 pressing new special edition copies of Rumours, and prices have gone up. This is 5th grade economics here.

 

2. Universal owns the whole pipe, from the artist to the studio to the manufacturing (at least, when they used to own plants of their own) to the distribution. 

 

 

3. 12" singles (at least the kind we're talking about) are more or less all promos, whether they're marked as such or not. They could eat a loss no sweat, because those cheap singles were getting played by DJs and other tastemakers, and that artist's music was getting extra exposure to sell a couple thousand more copies of their album, which had a huge profit margin.

 

For the most part, small labels doing small pressings are doing so because it makes the most sense for them. You keep bringing up Universal, Eminem, Justin Timberlake, as examples of how it should be done, but guess what? Universal has warehouses, huge staff, and hundreds of millions of dollars. Some of these labels you seem to hate are run out of bedrooms, garages, and basements. They don't have the capital or physical space to make thousands of copies of everything they put out just so it never goes out of print.

 

The thing is, I empathize with a lot of the cynicism you hold towards this message board. I hate splatter bullshit, I hate preorders, I hate $20+ single LPs, I hate the fact that people here get excited about Linkin Park and Evanescence and Limp Bizkit reissues and don't give a shit about great new music that's coming out. I think your anger is misplaced, though. This was never an "audiophile"-type vinyl board. It was founded in 2007 by a guy who ran a punk label, when vinyl was just starting to be more of a thing, and it was a place for people with punk/indie/hardcore-type tastes to get more info about what was coming out. Somewhere along the way, it warped into a place where Panic at the Disco has at least 5 separate threads and a guy who works for Hot Topic is revered as a god. But boy you need to take your Valium and stop yelling at a bunch of people who do not care that you like bootlegs or whatever. You hate collector bullshit, that's fine. Welcome to the club. I don't see myself as a collector, but I don't miss out on releases I'm interested in because of people who do. Is it possible that your rage comes from a place of self-loathing, because you have realized that you have the same music tastes as people who keep their records in frames on their walls?