redsonja

I think I'm going to give up with this thread Fortunately eBay contacted me this morning since the seller wrote to them in the middle of the night (just before 4AM) in some kind of attempt to beat me to escalating the case. However, eBay told me that they'd looked at the pictures and the entire exchange history and have agreed that the records are not in the condition advertised, and have offered a return label and a complete refund. Not ideal, as I'd still like to keep the three records which actually are in acceptable condition, but if we can't work that out I guess I'll just return the entire lot. Hopefully this has at least spared some people on this board from a similar situation with this guy.

One word, irony I don't think you quite understood that he wasn't using the word literally, literally. In the meantime, let's just have fun and discuss records? Bagging on someone's grammar is a pretty pointless exercise; You must have better things to do, right?

Yep he just made it up, and the pictures I posted are of the records before cleaning (obviously, as there's still so much dust and crap attached to them). What he is claiming is that he sent the records out in NM condition, and that since then I've somehow altered them to include them looking like they've been badly worn, stored, and played for the last twenty years. Again, I actually want to keep the three/four relatively decent records and I just want to return the eight or so that are badly damaged. He's trying every trick in the book I think to try and make it look like I've damaged the records but every time I've responded I've done it making sure that I correct those things he's said and I've asked for examples of when I said I'd washed the records or attempted to blackmail him, etc. but he never responds to those things. He never even responded to the photos I sent.

Hey again Slinch, thanks, I'll definitely bare that in mind! but I never once said that I'd washed the records, in fact I asked here about washing records as I have no idea how to do that. The only thing I did was use a carbon fiber brush to remove some of the surface dust so that I could check the sound quality on several of the records. That's it. And the photos I posted both here and to ebay clearly show that. It's kind of a catch 22 for me, because if I don't send the records back I don't get my money back but get to keep a batch of mostly shitty records, and if I do send the records back I lose the few records I can actually use and, most probably, all of my money too. The bottom line is this guy sold me a bunch of badly scratched records while insisting like he still does that they're in NM condition. About his claims that I've somehow 'altered the condition' from NM to Fair - is just crazy because anyone looking at those photos can see that the dust and scratches come from years of misuse. I guess fortunately for me the last twelve purchases I made from ebay comes to just under £500 (and doesn't include this guy's records), and I haven't had one single problem with any of them and I don't have any negative feedback, so that's got to count for something I guess?

best thing I've read all day

Whether he meant literally or figuratively, or even metaphorically, trying to provoke people is just a massive waste of everyone's time. Who cares - Raye made his point. Perfect and grammatically correct English doesn't exists in everyday speech without sounding like a robot. Sometimes people use phrases that are incorrect, so what? If this thread shouldn't be used for discussing certain genres of music then I'm pretty sure that picking on someone's grammar should also be irrelevant and taken elsewhere? Why don't you just PM him instead if it bothers you so much that you have to call him out on it? P.S. I actually erased that first line before you replied, but you got me too!! But If you want to get grammatical about it's called hyperbole, or at the very least sarcasm.

I'm not even going to post a proper response to that

Trying to belittle people on music forums for musical taste is a waste of time. Please stop.

Thanks, we already concluded that discussion in private :-) Plus it was Raye's thread, so I guess it was harmless to have quick a chat about bands.

Update. After posting the photos on my eBay case I heard nothing back from the seller for over three days, but this morning I just got this message: "As previously stated on numerous occaissions, please return items. We will not be held to ransom or blackmailed in respect of negotiating a discount on items that we know are accurately described in the original listing. We will review the returned items prior to refund as it has become apparent that you may have altered the condition. Ebay are due to make a final decision on this soon, so please sit tight until then francesca" The most confusing part of this except for the bit where the seller accuses me of holding him to ransom and blackmailing him (I mean, seriously, WTF?! I just want to return the seven records which are in shitty condition), is that the seller has after almost twenty messages suddenly changed gender and started to refer to himself as 'we'! Thankfully tomorrow is the date where I can finally ask eBay to look at this.

That's exactly what I thought! We'd talked about the condition and exchanged a good five messages and all seemed to be good, then they arrived in that awful condition so I messaged him, thanked him for the few records that actually were in good condition, and then said that sadly the others weren't as described and asked if he could contact me to resolve. I even went ahead and re-graded them and sent the list, just so he could see how widely he'd missed the mark. The only thing I got back from him was a message saying that no one has ever not agreed with his gradings before, and that I should send them back and he'd consider a refund if they were in the same condition he sent them in, according to his own gradings which he 'stands by'.

Thanks - and sure, I'll PM it over now

Update. After sending the photos and not hearing anything for over twenty four hours, the seller has sent a brief two line message back telling me that I have damaged the records and 'altered the condition' by 'washing' them!?! Which I obviously didn't do, as they're still caked in dust. So I guess I'm gonna have to leave this to eBay and wait until the end of the week when I can forward it to them.

Thanks LeeKaye, and thanks allenh, appreciate you looking at them and agree with everything you said. I didn't realise that hairlines are technically just from sleeve wear, so that's something I picked up. Hopefully I'll be able to get this refunded through ebay. It's a shame, as out of the 12 records, four of them actually are in EX condition more or less, and although No Prayer for the Dying looks pretty bad, it actually plays without a fault (unlike Seventh Son and Powerslave which have so much audible distortion it's unreal).

Thanks!! That's odd that you can't see the photos ... they're all there on my screen and there are seven of them? By the way - they're not my hairy hands, I'm the one holding the camera

Well, since I cleaned it up it's oddly good, even with that huge scratch it doesn't skip at all. Seriously though, I had to go to my neighbour and ask if could try them on her system, as she has a cheap TT she uses for the stuff she gets scouring flea markets and boot sales. I daren't play them on my system ...

Okay, here's the worst of the bunch. Powerslave, Piece of Mind, and No Prayer for the Dying. Seventh Son was also scratched and scuffed and covered in dust, but I haven't taken any photos of that one yet. These were all described and listed as EX/NM, verified by the seller when I asked him prior to sending out, and he also said 'they're meticulously looked after', 'they really are in amazing condition from a private collection', and 'they don't even need cleaning'. Seriously, I must've sent this guy at least four messages checking the condition and asking for him to listen to them, which he said he had, but only some, and that I shouldn't worry because they're in 'top' condition. I graded them like this: Piece of Mind - VG + - Thick dust, deep scratches mostly on side two (first track has a giant scratch running straight through it), with clicks and pops in quiet sections. Fortunately very little crackle, hence the 'plus' grading. Powerslave - G-/F+ - this one was covered in hairline scratches, moderate scratches, dirty patches that require a pro cleaning to remove, thick surface dust and debris ... Needless to say, clicks and pops and high crackle throughout. No Prayer for the Dying - VG - would have loved to have given this one a higher grading, as side one plays without much surface noise at all, but side two has scuffs and scratches which cause clicks and pops and, honestly, I wasn't sure if my stylus was going to track this at all or fly halfway across the room. Lots of dust and hair on this one. Needs a pro clean. Please take a look at the photos if you can, and I'd love to hear what you guys think and if I got my grading right? This is after three surface cleanings with an anti-stat brush, too! Some of that stuff just won't come off without taking a lot more time I guess (and why should I clean someone else's records ...). I've just sent these photos to eBay, and asked the seller to take a real good look and tell me if he still 'sticks by his NM grading' now ...

Ah, I see, I thought I could use the 'my media' button and upload directly here, but no worries, I'll make an account on one of the hosting sites and post back shortly, thanks!

Okay, so I've taken some photos - can anyone tell me how I'd upload them here?

Thanks everyone, that's really helped. I replied to the message before I read your comments, but if I don't hear anything or I get another idiotic response from him I'll phone eBay direct and go from there. I'm going to try and borrow a good camera later today and take some pictures. If I post them up here with his gradings and mine would you take a quick look and let me know what you think? I'm pretty new to records and gradings but even I can see that he's totally overgraded them. I actually thought I was being really fair in my re-grading too, but I guess he didn't see it that way...

Hey, yeah, fantastic I love pretty much all of the above! I grew up on Iron Maiden too, blame my folks, and I actually just saw WASP on tour last week. Blackie was surprisingly great, vox were incredible. Do you go to many gigs in the UK?

Update. I took everyone's advice and went through eBay first and raised a case since the seller wouldn't respond to my messages, and this morning I got a really odd reply back from him (now calling himself 'we', since he knows that eBay are watching), basically saying that I threatened him, insulted him, and attempted to blackmail him, and that I'm well known for trying to scam sellers for partial refunds and that he's reporting me to eBay in order to help other sellers 'be protected'. And all I could think was wow, what a pile of shit. He literally used 'we' and 'our company' throughout the mail until he got to the end and reverted back to 'I'. He's now asking that I return the records because he 'needs them asap', and he said that he would discount them if received back in the same condition as they were sent - which I pointed out that they are not, because they're now clean. I don't think this guy has any intention of refunding my money, and as soon as I send them I've got a feeling that he's going to say that they're not in the same condition and claim that I've damaged them or something, so I think my only choice is to try and get hold of a camera with a good macro and try and capture the scratches and scuffs and send them to eBay. What do you guys think? I might seem calm, but it really fucks me off that people actually act like this.

Thanks - never even considered that! I'm going to have to get a record cleaner ... after I've read through this entire thread again!

Hey, thanks Raye, and yep, it's been Chloe since 2002 ish. But Sonja, Chloe, either is fine by me! Thanks for the info, and I know what you mean about the boominess of the Red. Ever since my friend got her TT that was the one thing that stood out to me, and she did get some distortion on high vox too but it disappeared after a while. Sounds like the Blue is definitely the way to go then? She's pretty much sold on it anyway, so that confirms it I guess! You mentioned Rock/Metal - what bands are you into? Just curious!

I was skeptical, but I don't think they've sounded this Def Leppard-y since the early 90's. I remember they always used to be in the charts when I was a kid, and then the 90's happened and grunge which killed metal was killed by indie and bands like Suede and Blur and Oasis and other Brit Pop which, at the time, I used to hate being brought up by parents who were really into the 70's and 80's rock scene. So personal history lesson aside, I actually quite liked the single. Just not enough to buy the record yet.