Dusted_By_Space Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 Op radiatorhums 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 ..... Dude, you're out of touch, seriously. Here's the process that any of us take: 1) hey, I like that Abby Road album, I should pick it up on vinyl. 2) I'll check online to see if I can find a good deal somewhere like Discogs, eBay, or Amazon. 3) hmm, cheapest I found was Discogs for $10 shipped, I bet I can find it cheaper locally. 4) Hey, this Thift Store has a copy for $2, deal! What you are suggesting adds nothing to the process. Or any possible variation. No one here does garage sailing, most of us don't even go crate digging for the purpose of finding a deal. We have a specific album we want to buy, and if we can find it for a price we're willing to pay then we buy it. That's it. This gave me some perspective, because I do occasionally go to garage sales and look through crates. The records you are buying have to come from somewhere--I guess you prefer other people (like me) to do the dirty work. That being said, if you have a list in your head of every possible album ever that you'd like to listen to or buy, so be it. I am defeated. My speculation, though, is that part of you is always curious as to which album you would like to listen to next. When I'm listening to classical records, yes I am thinking of specific pieces. But I have to do research to find the best arrangements and pressings. When I went to buy my "Abbey Road" album, I didn't know the difference between an original pressing or a repressing. It took research to understand this. Sure, it was a personal thing, but I wanted to have an original record that was pressed when the Beatles were playing. But there are other reasons too, again. I couldn't find any information on Discogs about sonic differences between pressings, just a bunch of label variations and numbers. And to me that would be very helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 Or...you could just go to discogs where it is already listed. A diatribe, eh? You obviously overestimate how much I care about this. I just think you're wasting your time. Discogs is essentially what you're suggesting without a bunch of extra useless shit. I don't think you care about the idea per se, but you certainly have a vested interest in arguing when there was no argument to begin with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llamaface Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 I'm just wondering what you all think. Good/bad? Illogical? Will never go anywhere? No argument to begin with, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 No argument to begin with, eh? How in the hell is that an argument? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGhostOfRandySavage Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 I, like most people who use this site, have a running list of titles I'm actually searching out. When I go to garage sales or crate digging though, if something looks interesting and is in good shape, am I going to balk at paying $1 or $2 for it? No. Since that is the going price most times in those situations, why would I need a wiki to give me a bunch of useless information about the release? I already know that I'm comfortable paying $1-$2 for that record and I know how to take it back to my home and play it. Will knowing that the composer of that album suffered from depression, eventually killing himself by jumping in front of a train make me enjoy the album any more or less? Nope. Now. You're the one who asked for opinions on this, so I'm giving you mine. I'm not trying to have an argument with you, just explain why I think this idea isn't anything new or even desirable. As far as me being the one to bring up pricing... In a way, I sort of feel like it could be sort of a combination of Discogs and a record collecting book/guide. You can't really find tips and extreme specifics in Discogs, from what I understand. (And don't kick me for already saying that I've never used Discogs ) Both of those things are used as pricing guides, so it doesn't seem misguided to think there would be pricing information on your wiki after this comparison. "Extreme specifics" on Discogs: How much more specific do you want to get beyond artist, title, label, year released, matrix etching, catalog number, differences between variants including vinyl color, differences in the actual paper label, differences in the cover, the inner sleeve, rpms...the list goes on. All of those things can be added on discogs. Clearly, having never used discogs, you wouldn't know that these are easily added to a release, maybe check it out sometime. It seems the main things you desire for this wiki would be: 1)No formatting restrictions. Which as has been pointed out to you will just make it harder to find the info you're looking for in each releases entry harder. 2)Editing by non-members. Which has also been pointed out in this thread may lead to problems. Yes, other users will police some releases. But as I said before there are so many releases out there and so many variants of those releases that to have someone checking up on each and every release is impossible. There will be some releases that are not as popular as others that will get left by the wayside with incorrect information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtz Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 I don't think a misunderstanding is a try. Not really sure why you're deliberately insulting me, either. The question then becomes, is it worth what someone is asking for? Yes, again, Discogs (apparently) and Popsike have sale data. But if you're in front of a seller, presented by 1,000 records, are you really going to look them up individually? No, because the seller might not be too happy, and it will take forever. I do go crate digging and go to garage sales, estate sales, etc... I am not sure what you are getting at here though. How is your wiki site going to determine a value on a random stack of 1,000 records? If anything, I was just wondering whether it would be worth my time to write anymore or continue paying hosting fees. I would say no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 Still trying to figure out why you all take so personally the intrusion of a new website Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGhostOfRandySavage Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 Still trying to figure out why you all take so personally the intrusion of a new website Still trying to figure out why you think anyone is taking this personally. You asked for opinions and you're getting them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llamaface Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 I'm convinced that discpedia is Nick Alt trying to find a way to convince people that VNYL's records are actually valuable because of their awesome sonic quality. Seriously, you asked for opinions. Call it a debate, discussion or argument... it's all the same. There might be someone that agrees with you here, but they haven't shown up yet. I don't understand the need for this website or its appeal at all, and you haven't done anything to convince me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 I'm convinced that discpedia is Nick Alt trying to find a way to convince people that VNYL's records are actually valuable because of their awesome sonic quality. Seriously, you asked for opinions. Call it a debate, discussion or argument... it's all the same. There might be someone that agrees with you here, but they haven't shown up yet. I don't understand the need for this website or its appeal at all, and you haven't done anything to convince me. First post was "YAY," so I'll take that to the bank. Actually, someone signed up since yesterday. Go figure. I did ask for opinions. I didn't ask for people to start an internet battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 I do go crate digging and go to garage sales, estate sales, etc... I am not sure what you are getting at here though. How is your wiki site going to determine a value on a random stack of 1,000 records? I would say no. I don't usually purchase 1,000/1,000 records, otherwise my house would be full to the brim. Typically I'll look through for ones that I want to buy. The hope is that there will be content to advise people which records to pick and which to reject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusted_By_Space Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 Op the thing that you keep mentioning is wanting info on what pressing sounds the best. How would one quantify that. Sound quality is subjective to many different variables, so ultimately, wouldn't your page be just like any other message board? Just a bunch of pages cluttered with various peoples varying opinions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 Both of those things are used as pricing guides, so it doesn't seem misguided to think there would be pricing information on your wiki after this comparison. "Extreme specifics" on Discogs: How much more specific do you want to get beyond artist, title, label, year released, matrix etching, catalog number, differences between variants including vinyl color, differences in the actual paper label, differences in the cover, the inner sleeve, rpms...the list goes on. All of those things can be added on discogs. Clearly, having never used discogs, you wouldn't know that these are easily added to a release, maybe check it out sometime. It seems the main things you desire for this wiki would be: 1)No formatting restrictions. Which as has been pointed out to you will just make it harder to find the info you're looking for in each releases entry harder. 2)Editing by non-members. Which has also been pointed out in this thread may lead to problems. Yes, other users will police some releases. But as I said before there are so many releases out there and so many variants of those releases that to have someone checking up on each and every release is impossible. There will be some releases that are not as popular as others that will get left by the wayside with incorrect information. Fair enough, it doesn't seem misguided... but then again, it depends on who's the content creator. I never explicitly stated that I would create a wiki price guide. I have been on Discogs but never really liked it. Obviously that's the point. You're still trying to compare apples and oranges here. There was never any insinuation of being a replacement for Discogs. I love Popsike, but the information can be hard to find. Most tools work best together. Regarding my 'desires' and the problems with them, I really don't see how those are valid issues. Believing they are is refusing to have trust in the idea of a wiki itself and the record collecting community. There are Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings wikis for God's sake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 Op the thing that you keep mentioning is wanting info on what pressing sounds the best. How would one quantify that. Sound quality is subjective to many different variables, so ultimately, wouldn't your page be just like any other message board? Just a bunch of pages cluttered with various peoples varying opinions? Sound quality on a personal level is subjective... but it's also quantifiable at the same time. First of all, sound waves are measurable--so I don't see how you missed that. Isn't one of the main reasons people prefer vinyl the difference between sonic qualities of analog and digital reproduction? Please correct me if I'm wrong. And regarding the message board analogy... yes, but not cluttered. That's the point. And more readily searchable. Wouldn't you rather have one article titled "Discpedia: the Idea We at VinylCollective Think is Stupid" than read through this whole posting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 One of the most popular Beatles collecting books is by Bruce Spizer. It's an out of print two volume set that regular commands a premium on eBay due to its desirability. One book is basically a biography of the Beatles. But the other is a huge book describing variations, rarity, dates, etc. No prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusted_By_Space Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 So you would like users of your site to purchase the exact same setup, record the audio and then analyze that data, then they would need to repeat the process for every different pressing of an individual record, and post those results to your site? And btw no I have rather enjoyed this whole thread, it's killed pretty much my entire afternoon waiting for my girl to get back from a funeral while our power is out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 So you would like users of your site to purchase the exact same setup, record the audio and then analyze that data, then they would need to repeat the process for every different pressing of an individual record, and post those results to your site? The hyperbole you continue to employ are pretty irritating. No, because obviously that's not possible. But what is possible is for one user maybe to compare two different pressings. He writes something down. Another reader happens to have knowledge about other variations and builds onto it. The point is, instead of referring to one website created by one or a few others, refer to a website created by many people with many different sources of knowledge. Wikipedia itself is not complete. If you search something relatively unheard of, you will likely find no answer. When I search my name (because I'm a nobody, clearly), nothing comes up. But I have the option to create something. Maybe I'll make myself sound amazing, "Basically a real life superman." If someone reads this and disagrees, they can change it. If nobody reads it, chances are it's pretty unimportant in the first place. (that adds onto what whoever was saying about the neglected articles). There are also features in the Mediawiki core to allow for revision of neglected pages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 I think the main issue here is that of close mindedness. Rather than consider the ways that a wiki could potentially ever be useful, (other than the "yay!"), a lot of people here are deciding to call me out, as if I insulted everything they hold dear to record collecting. And truly, the arguing gets old. If this ever does turn into anything, you will probably feel pretty silly. If nothing happens, then I'll just say so be it and move onto other things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusted_By_Space Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 ok, well again when you get this site up and running post us a link, I'm sure a lot of us will check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 It is running. I don't know why that link didn't work, but the main page loads. There are apparently some server glitches, but all it needs is a continued source of content. Being reasonable doesn't hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGhostOfRandySavage Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 I think the main issue here is that of close mindedness. Rather than consider the ways that a wiki could potentially ever be useful, (other than the "yay!"), a lot of people here are deciding to call me out, as if I insulted everything they hold dear to record collecting. And truly, the arguing gets old. If this ever does turn into anything, you will probably feel pretty silly. If nothing happens, then I'll just say so be it and move onto other things. I think you're right. You're being very close minded to the very legitimate concerns people have about your website and what new or improved things it will offer. You probably shouldn't take that yay too seriously. I really think you're the only one who thinks this discussion...which you started by the way, is an argument. If this does "turn into anything" I personally won't feel silly at all. I'll think, "well good for him. Guess I was wrong," and then move on with my life just like you'll do if this tanks. At least it's good to know there's someone out there who has the entire "record wiki" think figured out. It's been weighing on my mind for a while and now I can stop worrying about it. You seem very defensive about this when in reality it was you who came in here asking our opinion about your idea. The big thing to remember is that if you really are only 19 as your profile would have us believe, a lot of us have been at this whole record thing for half your life or more. We've seen ideas like this before, and we know the pitfalls. I would guess that's why you came here asking about it...unless you thought this was a brand new idea that people were going to just pat you on the back for and tell you how great you are. Edit: I tried making an entry. Your server is complete shit, dude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 I don't feel like replying to these anymore. If you believe I'm the only one who thinks this is an argument, maybe you should look at the first several comments up until Kurts'. There are a lot of personal attacks in a majority of these comments that are really just completely pointless. Pointing out anyone's personal flaws does not change the idea. But yes, I agree the server is terrible. Godaddy is the cause, not me. The server upgrade to a VPS is an extra $25 a month on top of $8 that I'm already paying. $8 is manageable for now, while I'm trying to figure out what to do. Dedicated servers are $120, so, you know. Regardless, I appreciate that you visited and tried to make an entry in the first place. Sounds like a step to me. Everything has to start somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGhostOfRandySavage Posted June 13, 2015 Share Posted June 13, 2015 I don't feel like replying to these anymore. If you believe I'm the only one who thinks this is an argument, maybe you should look at the first several comments up until Kurts'. But yes, I agree the server is terrible. Godaddy is the cause, not me. The server upgrade to a VPS is an extra $25 a month on top of $8 that I'm already paying. $8 is manageable for now, while I'm trying to figure out what to do. Dedicated servers are $120, so, you know. Regardless, I appreciate that you visited and tried to make an entry in the first place. Sounds like a step to me. Everything has to start somewhere. So...the first comment that says "Yay!" and is a sarcastic comment that he posted about in another thread, then? Everyone else has told you reasons not to do this. We started out trying to be constructive with our criticism but you wouldn't take that. Full disclosure: It was going to be a joke entry about a fictional band's fictional album and the info was just "wank wank wank wank wank." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discpedia Posted June 13, 2015 Author Share Posted June 13, 2015 So...the first comment that says "Yay!" and is a sarcastic comment that he posted about in another thread, then? Everyone else has told you reasons not to do this. We started out trying to be constructive with our criticism but you wouldn't take that. Full disclosure: It was going to be a joke entry about a fictional band's fictional album and the info was just "wank wank wank wank wank." Fair enough. Who is 'we'? How exactly is "unusable clusterfuck" constructive criticism? That's weird, it works for me. I don't think you're being discouraging. I was sure I'd be met with a lot of this kind of stuff. In reality, it was just an idea. And if it turns out to be a good one, maybe it's worth pursuing. Yes, there are plenty of websites, but the point is to compile them all into one area, where anyone can edit and add their own tips. That's the purpose of wikipedia--it's just for everything, not records. In a forum, yes there are tips and tricks, but you have to sort through disorganized information for what you're looking for. Full disclosure: I see your point now. You are very mature and I should listen to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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