moonbeams Posted May 11, 2012 Share Posted May 11, 2012 First off, thanks for making this area of the forum. For the past 2 years, I have been using a Pro-ject Debut III run through a Denon DRA-F107 mini-sound system. The F107 has a phono input, but the signal for phono input has been quite low. I have also been using Denon AH-D1000headphones. To get a loud signal, I would have the volume at around 33 out of 60 max for records (CD player gets the same volume at around 17). I just upgraded headphones to AH-D5000. To get the same level of loudness, I need to run the volume up to 45/50. There is a terrible hissing sound whenever a singer pronounces an S sound, it sounds like ZZZs. I decided to play at half volume and the hissing ZZZs were eliminated. Obviously I need some kind of amp, but I don't know if I need a phono preamp or headphones amp. I have never used either, so I am unfamiliar with them. I have speakers, but I live in a small apartment, so there is no chance to play them loud. Thank you for your help!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philviral Posted May 11, 2012 Share Posted May 11, 2012 Sounds like there are two problems here. First, the hissing sound you describe, is called sibilance. It's caused by the cartridge on your turntable. If you are still using the stock cartridge on your Debut III, it's widely known as being a sibilant cartridge. There are many replacements available for under 150 that could probably do a better job. Your old headphones probably just weren't revealing enough to expose the sibilance. Your second problem is the low volume. The Denon headphones can be driven out of normal headphone jacks but the bass and punch will be lacking, they benefit a lot from a headphone amp. Taking a guess here that a headphone amp could solve your issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonbeams Posted May 11, 2012 Author Share Posted May 11, 2012 phil, I appreciate the answer. The cartridge is a DL-110. I used one for 2 years and just replaced it with a new one 2 weeks ago. (You cannot replace the stylus, unfortunately). Any recommendations on a headphone amp? I killed my budget on the headphones.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted May 11, 2012 Share Posted May 11, 2012 You will definitely benefit from a better phono stage, and you will definitely benefit from a headphone amp. If you don't need a combo unit (amp/DAC), there are many really good options for around $250. Check out: Schiit Asgard Matrix M-Stage Little Dot MK III At a lower price point: Little Dot I+ ($150, really good for low impedance headphones) Or if you just want to try what $50 can get you: Muse Audio Class A Hybrid. I have read nothing but positive things about this unit, have no experience with it, but definitely seems like a really good budget amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daver Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Or if you just want to try what $50 can get you: Muse Audio Class A Hybrid. I have read nothing but positive things about this unit, have no experience with it, but definitely seems like a really good budget amp. There is a negative review on amazon that this headphone amp gets "too" hot, also the manufacturers website isn't working (http://www.muse-audio.com), and I am unsure if There is one for $64 and one for $50 and I can't tell the difference, the one for $64 maybe comes with an AC adapter. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dmi&field-keywords=Muse+Audio+Class+A+Hybrid Anyway, I want to have a nice CD and vinyl listening experience. I've been stuck on laptop speakers and Skullcandy FMJ earbuds for a few years now. I want to get a nice set up, but can't afford it all now. I have some Sennheiser HD555 headphones I like but no way to use them. I have a cheapo Sony belt-driven $120 turntable. It seems like the most budget friendly way to go about this while not shooting myself in the foot with crappy stuff would be 1-Get a headphone amp 2-Get a nicer turntable 3-Get a Harman Kardon 3390 reciever for $230 4-Get speakers I'm about to move into a super small apartment so headphones would be better right now anyway. This phono preamp keeps getting brought up a lot - http://www.amazon.com/ART-Pre-II-Phono-Preamp/dp/B000AJR482?tag=533643275-20 - but doesn't have a 1/4" output .. Is the difference between a phono preamp and a headphone amp really only the output type? Thanks for your help all.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 There is a negative review on amazon that this headphone amp gets "too" hot, also the manufacturers website isn't working (http://www.muse-audio.com), and I am unsure if There is one for $64 and one for $50 and I can't tell the difference, the one for $64 maybe comes with an AC adapter. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dmi&field-keywords=Muse+Audio+Class+A+Hybrid Anyway, I want to have a nice CD and vinyl listening experience. I've been stuck on laptop speakers and Skullcandy FMJ earbuds for a few years now. I want to get a nice set up, but can't afford it all now. I have some Sennheiser HD555 headphones I like but no way to use them. I have a cheapo Sony belt-driven $120 turntable. It seems like the most budget friendly way to go about this while not shooting myself in the foot with crappy stuff would be 1-Get a headphone amp 2-Get a nicer turntable 3-Get a Harman Kardon 3390 reciever for $230 4-Get speakers I'm about to move into a super small apartment so headphones would be better right now anyway. This phono preamp keeps getting brought up a lot - http://www.amazon.com/ART-Pre-II-Phono-Preamp/dp/B000AJR482?tag=533643275-20 - but doesn't have a 1/4" output .. Is the difference between a phono preamp and a headphone amp really only the output type? Thanks for your help all.. I usually don't take reviews on amazon seriously, but this is not to say that in this particular case it isn't true. I have no experience with this amp so I really cannot say. The one you linked for $64 is apparently a MkII version, but I have no idea what the difference is. Regarding your HD 555 headphones, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to use them, because they work perfectly well out of any source, be it a laptop, portable player etc. Not to their full potential, but still. As for your "to buy" list, I think the best idea might be a good vintage amp. For around $150-$200 you can get a perfectly restored Marantz 1060. The headphone output is on par with any stand-alone headphone amp in the $100-$150 range, the phono stage is easily better than any <$100 phono preamp, and sonically it will outperform any new receiver in the $400 range, including that Harman Kardon. The only drawback really is that it's hard to find one in perfect working condition, but I'm sure that for $200 and with a little patience, it can be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonbeams Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 I really appreciate the replys, everyone. I read the instruction guide of my DL-110 cartridge and it says that because it's a MC, it doesn't need a preamp. That doesn't make sense because when I listen to headphones, the CD is fine on a low volume, but the phono needs to be cranked up. But the amp, CD player, cartridge, and headphones are all Denon, so I will follow the company's instructions. As for the helpfulness of Amazon reviews, sometimes that's all there is to go by. I ordered AT-HA21headphones amp from Amazon. I did so by reading reviews (all in Japanese, I'm not sure if this is sold outside Japan). I really wanted a cheaper model (there were 2 cheaper ones), but both had some bad reviews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 It completely slipped my mind that the DL-110 is a MC cart. Even though it's a "high-output" MC cart, the actual output voltage is still considerably lower than that of an average MM cart. You kind of shot yourself in the foot with choosing that cart for your setup. Generally the cost to make a MC cart sound good is much higher compared to using a MM one. Ideally you'd need a table with a really strong, solid drive, which isn't really one of Debut's strengths. Then there's the phono stage, which has to be "MC compatible", hopefully with an impedance selector, and for the best results a step-up transformer is recommended with high output MC carts as well (while it is essential with low output MC carts). So even though you can get a "giant-killer" MC cart that is quite inexpensive (the most highly regarded example is the Denon DL-103 ($220)), the costs that come with it mean it's far from a budget cart. Also, congrats on the headphone amp. I've never heard of it, it seems it's a Japan exclusive - like (too) many other Audio Technica products, but I'm sure it will serve you well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonbeams Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 Thanks for the info Slinch. Every time I purchase a new component, I find out that I need yet another.. Now I have new problem, hooking up the headphone amp.. will make a new thread because I'm sure others might run into this problem as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daver Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 There is a negative review on amazon that this headphone amp gets "too" hot, also the manufacturers website isn't working (http://www.muse-audio.com), and I am unsure if There is one for $64 and one for $50 and I can't tell the difference, the one for $64 maybe comes with an AC adapter. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dmi&field-keywords=Muse+Audio+Class+A+Hybrid Anyway, I want to have a nice CD and vinyl listening experience. I've been stuck on laptop speakers and Skullcandy FMJ earbuds for a few years now. I want to get a nice set up, but can't afford it all now. I have some Sennheiser HD555 headphones I like but no way to use them. I have a cheapo Sony belt-driven $120 turntable. It seems like the most budget friendly way to go about this while not shooting myself in the foot with crappy stuff would be 1-Get a headphone amp 2-Get a nicer turntable 3-Get a Harman Kardon 3390 reciever for $230 4-Get speakers I'm about to move into a super small apartment so headphones would be better right now anyway. This phono preamp keeps getting brought up a lot - http://www.amazon.com/ART-Pre-II-Phono-Preamp/dp/B000AJR482?tag=533643275-20 - but doesn't have a 1/4" output .. Is the difference between a phono preamp and a headphone amp really only the output type? Thanks for your help all.. I usually don't take reviews on amazon seriously, but this is not to say that in this particular case it isn't true. I have no experience with this amp so I really cannot say. The one you linked for $64 is apparently a MkII version, but I have no idea what the difference is. Regarding your HD 555 headphones, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to use them, because they work perfectly well out of any source, be it a laptop, portable player etc. Not to their full potential, but still. As for your "to buy" list, I think the best idea might be a good vintage amp. For around $150-$200 you can get a perfectly restored Marantz 1060. The headphone output is on par with any stand-alone headphone amp in the $100-$150 range, the phono stage is easily better than any <$100 phono preamp, and sonically it will outperform any new receiver in the $400 range, including that Harman Kardon. The only drawback really is that it's hard to find one in perfect working condition, but I'm sure that for $200 and with a little patience, it can be done. thanks for your reply! (sorry to hijack your thread a bit pizza). i ended up finding a Sanyo JCX 2100K and an Akia GXC 39d cassette deck for $25 (for both). i'm set now. ill wait around for a speaker deal next i think. i need to break in my hd555s! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonbeams Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 hi-jack away! the purpose of these threads is for the public good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reznor2112 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 So quick question. I am getting a Pro-ject Essential II and was planning on getting the Schiit Magna 2 Uber headphone amp. 1. Do I need a preamp or can i just run the Essential II to the Schiit Magni 2? http://schiit.com/products/magni-2 2. With the Schiit Magni 2 Uber, there is an RCA out on the back as well...does this mean if I want to at a later date, I can plug in 2 stereo speakers to this headphone amp and this to the records that way. I apologize in advance for my ignorance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 1. yes, you will need a phono preamp 2. yes, kind of. If you buy active speakers, then you can just plug them in. If you buy passive speakers, you'll need a separate amplifier as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reznor2112 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Ok, So with the Essential II, i will also need to order a pre amp along with the headphone amp? Im assuming the connection will be Turntable<PreAmp<HeadphoneAmp? Thanks for the info! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 well technically the connection will be Turntable>PreAmp>HeadphoneAmp, but yeah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reznor2112 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 (slapping myself) Ok, I swear...last question. If I went with the Essential II USB that has the built in pre-amp, I could hook the turntable directly up to the Schiit Magni2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinch Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Correct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reznor2112 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Many many many Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_stretts Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Why not go integrated and have it all in one box? Plenty of decent options on the market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.