Tommy Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Recently bought a PM8004 and while it sounds fantastically clear I feel it's lacking in the bass department. In the meantime while I save for some bigger speakers I was thinking of buying a cheap subwoofer on CL. There is one on there that is powered with volume control and 1 input. No low pass filter. My question, if I run a mono cable from the pre-out on the PM8004 to the sub without any EQ is this going to be worth it or a waste of my time Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Cheap subs in general are a waste of time. If bass is lacking, it's most likely due to your speakers. I have the same amp and originally used it with Monitor Audio RX1 speakers. For funsies I hooked up the matching Monitor Audio RXW-12 subwoofer. There was definitely more bass presence but otherwise, it didn't do much for me. I would just put the $ toward your speaker upgrade. IF you decide to proceed, you will need a sub with a crossover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 2, 2016 Author Share Posted February 2, 2016 Cheap subs in general are a waste of time. If bass is lacking, it's most likely due to your speakers. I have the same amp and originally used it with Monitor Audio RX1 speakers. For funsies I hooked up the matching Monitor Audio RXW-12 subwoofer. There was definitely more bass presence but otherwise, it didn't do much for me. I would just put the $ toward your speaker upgrade. IF you decide to proceed, you will need a sub with a crossover. Thanks Tard! You mentioned you originally used it with the Monitor Audio RX1. What speakers are you using today? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajxd Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I'd be shocked if it's the amp. What speakers are you using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Thanks Tard! You mentioned you originally used it with the Monitor Audio RX1. What speakers are you using today? currently using Monitor Audio RX8s purchased on Craig's List for around $700. Though I should mention that I could have easily stuck with the RX1s and not really been missing out on any bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 2, 2016 Author Share Posted February 2, 2016 I'd be shocked if it's the amp. What speakers are you using? I've got a set of Velodyne LD2 from craigslist. Never been too impressed with them but switching to the PM8004 i've noticed a drop off in bass so I don't know. I was using a shitty old Yamaha stereo receiver before, RX-360 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 are you sure you're actually missing bass? Or is it just a boomy sound your old receiver made to approximate bass? A lot of people have been trained to expect that noise instead of the actual intended sound of honest bass. Another question that comes to mind is how you have the treble/mid/bass controls set. I typically use the Source Direct mode to bypass the tone control, but if you want to dial in more bass, you can try turning Source Direct off and dialing in more bass to see if it makes a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
circuit bored records Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 If you do get a subwoofer you would ideally have one with crossover control on the back of it and not just a gain knob so you can set it accordingly with the appropriate frequency response of your speakers, since the pm8004 doesn't have any crossover setting. Although I do agree you may just be hearing the actual limitation of your speakers, and nothing to do with the amp. The LD2 only go to 85Hz so I wouldn't expect them to sound especially bass-y Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajxd Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 If you do get a subwoofer you would ideally have one with crossover control on the back of it and not just a gain knob so you can set it accordingly with the appropriate frequency response of your speakers, since the pm8004 doesn't have any crossover setting. Although I do agree you may just be hearing the actual limitation of your speakers, and nothing to do with the amp. The LD2 only go to 85Hz so I wouldn't expect them to sound especially bass-y Only 85Hz?! Jesus. There's your bass issue. Hell my Veneres are weak bass at 50Hz. I was too spoiled by my VR3s with 35Hz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allenh Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Are you sure your speakers are actually located correctly? or is the room sucking up all the bass? As Tardcore said the old Yammy might just have been fooling you where the Marantz is trying to do it properly Try moving the speakers around, further away from walls and then nearer to them both front and side Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 2, 2016 Author Share Posted February 2, 2016 I think you all have exposed the issue here with the speakers. I'm finding out the expense of growing a decent system the hard way as each component I upgrade is exposing new issues with my existing weak links. I knew this was an expensive hobby, but i'm really starting to feel it now . I'm only smiling so I don't cry. On to new speakers we gooooooooooo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 For the price of a cheap subwoofer, you very likely could move up to some used speakers that cover a bit more range. It sounds like those Velodyne's were designed specifically to work with a matching subwoofer or simply to pull surround duty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
circuit bored records Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I think you all have exposed the issue here with the speakers. I'm finding out the expense of growing a decent system the hard way as each component I upgrade is exposing new issues with my existing weak links. I knew this was an expensive hobby, but i'm really starting to feel it now . I'm only smiling so I don't cry. On to new speakers we gooooooooooo I'm not as opposed to subwoofers as others on this forum are... My current speakers go down to 45Hz and I still use a sub with them, granted its mostly for home theater use as an application but I still think a 2.1 system for music with better components is a better alternative than getting cheap tower speakers that may look better on a spec sheet that in reality may not sound as good.. Basically if you like the way your velodynes sound outside of bass performance, a matching sub probably isn't a terrible idea as opposed to getting all new speakers entirely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smwalsh6 Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Considering Velodyne is so geared towards subwoofers, I can't imagine those speakers weren't designed to be used with a corresponding sub. No way they'd put out a pair of speakers with a crossover that only goes down to 85Hz. I mean, I have a pair of those cheap ass Andrew Jones Pioneer bookshelves in my bedroom and those get down to 55Hz with a 4" woofer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 2, 2016 Author Share Posted February 2, 2016 Another question that comes to mind is how you have the treble/mid/bass controls set. I typically use the Source Direct mode to bypass the tone control, but if you want to dial in more bass, you can try turning Source Direct off and dialing in more bass to see if it makes a difference. I am bypassing source direct as that setting sounds even thinner. I have the bass at 10, Mid at a 4 and Treb at 5. With that setting I would expect a very thick sound but that is not the case. I don't normally ride the bass at a 10 but I am forced right now to keep this thing from sounding like an AM radio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donnelltech Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Is it possible that you accidentally wired the speakers out of phase when you hooked up the new amp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 2, 2016 Author Share Posted February 2, 2016 Is it possible that you accidentally wired the speakers out of phase when you hooked up the new amp? Out of phase meaning red in black and black in red? If so, it's a possibility. I'd have to check when I get home Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 I'm not as opposed to subwoofers as others on this forum are... My current speakers go down to 45Hz and I still use a sub with them, granted its mostly for home theater use as an application but I still think a 2.1 system for music with better components is a better alternative than getting cheap tower speakers that may look better on a spec sheet that in reality may not sound as good.. Basically if you like the way your velodynes sound outside of bass performance, a matching sub probably isn't a terrible idea as opposed to getting all new speakers entirely MATCHING sub is the operative word. He originally mentioned just picking up a cheap sub. I'm pretty confident that just grabbing a rando subwoofer for $50 or whatever isn't going to be as good a solution as releasing the Velodynes back into the used market and picking up something that covers a fuller range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allenh Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 Anybody got the specs on these Velodynes? it might answer a few questions and the out of phase suggestion is a possibility to be checked at least Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donnelltech Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 Yes, by out of phase I meant you would have the positve/negative switched on one of the speakers. If they are out of phase then one speaker's drivers are moving opposite of the other's. The most obvious symptom of this is a lack off fullness and bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 Ok, first off, thanks to everyone for the help on this. I can confirm it was in fact the speakers themselves and not the wiring. I hooked up another set from my garage today and, my god, bass galore. Turns out my last shitty receiver was just putting out rumble that resembled bass and the PM8004 just tightened it up revealing the flaws of my LD2s. Now onto the next topic. I prefer pretty heavy bass. Good speaker recommendations to pair with the PM8004 that handle bass well? 3-400 range and preferably large bookshelf size. Thanks again everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
circuit bored records Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 Did ajxd sell his definitive technology bookshelves from a while back? Decent bass on those bad boys. Any chance there is a hifi shop near you for you to demo some different brand/models out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted February 11, 2016 Author Share Posted February 11, 2016 How do those StudioMonitor 55's stand up compared to the Wharfedale Diamond bookshelf speakers? About the same price ~300 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 depends on which diamonds...I would go with the 10.1s (old) or the new version (I think it's 220?) over the Def Techs. I have owned: Def Tech 350s (good) Wharfedale Diamond 10.1s (better) Monitor Audio RX1 (best) You can still get a pair of RX1s for around $3-350 if you keep a sharp eye out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tardcore Posted February 11, 2016 Share Posted February 11, 2016 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Monitor-Audio-Silver-Rx1-One-pair-Mint-Condition-Never-Been-Used-No-Box-/262284700801?hash=item3d1162ec81:g:UTcAAOSwKtVWu1jt So-so price. opening bid is $300 and shipping is a big steep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.