new Technics Grand Class SL 1200G turntable

[Billich0986]

Apparently the cost for the limited model will be $4k. Once they run out, the price of the standard model will also be $4k.

http://djtechtools.com/2016/01/07/new-technics-sl-1200ggae-will-cost-4000/

[slinch]

those comments though

 

[xxmartinxx]

old technologies from the 70s regardless.

The new table has a bunch of improvements.

 

Oh shit, does it?  I hope it has built in USB and a phono preamp.  

 

Time has passed this design by.  Why would someone spend good money on this when that good money is better spent with a company like VPI?  

[allenh]

LOL at people bitchin that it's over $7xx. The 1200 was $700, IN 1980

 

And it was way too expensive then, it's way too expensive now and even for the price of an average condition used one the price is way too high now and always has been. $700 or the £ equivalent could buy some very high end tables back in 1980

 

The 1200 is a perfectly good table but by no stretch of the imagination a stunner or audiophile gem, what it is though is a style icon and a legend that bears no resemblance to it's performance but dictates it's value. The original late 70's non DJ 1200 got a good reputation because they were cheap to buy used, had very good start characteristics, good motor torque and you could beat the shit out of them and they worked every time, Panasonic picked up on this and added the functions a DJ of the time needed, employed some names to use them, spent a lot on advertising and a very enduring legend was born, it also helped that they carried on supporting them for a long time after everyone said vinyl was dead and for that they very much deserve our respect.

 

I understand they are in business to make money and there is only so long they can milk this legend for but the prices for the new ones are just eye watering when you consider that consumer electronics as a whole have dropped in price compared to the prices of the 1970's, 1980's and 1990's because production costs have dropped through the floor

 

I used them professionally in the late 80's early 90's and there was better about back then as a DJ table and certainly as a hifi table which could be had for less money, now I'm not in that world so can't say as a DJ table but I understand the Pioneer PLX1000 is worthy competition and it's certainly still true as a hifi table and used this is even more true.

 

I've got one here that I now have a replacement for so will sell at some point and the money I get back for it will be invested in to something of much greater performance, not sure what yet though and for that 1200 legend and the price it brings I thank that legend very much.

[allenh]

Oh shit, does it?  I hope it has built in USB and a phono preamp.  

 

Time has passed this design by.  Why would someone spend good money on this when that good money is better spent with a company like VPI?  

 

There are quite often times when the words in my head shouldn’t come out of my mouth and the first time I see one of these new 1200's in someone’s house will be one of those moments, along with being asked not to come back again.

[allenh]

those comments though

 

 

Oops

[brillwill]

I think that everyone can agree that the new 1200 is a luxury item. I am very curious about the new motor design; if it's batting with the VPI Classic Direct ($30k) or other high end direct drives, then it would appear to be a bargain. However, if you really want to put things in perspective, plenty more people routinely spend $5-8k on high end mechanical watches like Rolex, Panerai, etc. I assume that this population is the target audience for the new 1200G. 

[slinch]

I assume that this population is the target audience for the new 1200G. 

 

I'd guess not, because you can't show off your new table to random people on the street.

 

On a serious note, I recently heard tat this new technics should have a lot in common with their SP10 mk3, so in that regard it might actually be a god value.

[thebilljim]

I'm only coming into this thread to say to slinch that your sig gif is incredibly pleasant to watch.

[xxmartinxx]

http://www.analogplanet.com/content/new-technics-sl-1200gae-not-your-fathers-old-technics-sl-1200mk2#PiBaVcveSY2MDXA1.97

 

So, there are some decent upgrades, however I still think you could spend that money better elsewhere.

[allenh]

I want to hear one, Technics have obviously put some work into it but my instinct is still that I will be able to buy better for less. I want to know if I’ve effectively written this off as just a very expensive SL1200 or if it is actually any good.

 

I am hard on the 12XX tables because in my opinion they are very overpriced for what they are but I still want to hear one of these, the problem is to be sure I would want it here with something like a Koetsu in it and to be able to run it for a decent length of time.

 

I think the biggest problem they have in general now is one of perception as they have based the concept on the SL1200 because of it's legend and brand recognition when if they were aiming at the high end they should have based the concept on something like the SP10, audiophiles would have lapped that up instead of turning up their noses and the perception of a high end product would have been easier to sell.

[slinch]

so this is a cool little info thingy: http://www.thevinylfactory.com/vinyl-factory-releases/the-evolution-of-the-technics-sl-1200-turntable-an-interactive-timeline/

[xxmartinxx]

 

I am hard on the 12XX tables because in my opinion they are very overpriced for what they are...

 

I agree, but I also have an issue with it being seen as a touchstone hi-fi product.  They're arguably the best known turntable, but I think that without the advent of hip hop and scratching, that wouldn't be the case.  I also think that a lot of people new to turntables look at this table and think, "this table is considered 'the best' (again, by people who don't know much about turntables), therefore direct drive, 'S' shaped tone arms, and bells and whistles are preferable." when we know this isn't the case.

[allenh]

I agree, but I also have an issue with it being seen as a touchstone hi-fi product.  They're arguably the best known turntable, but I think that without the advent of hip hop and scratching, that wouldn't be the case.  I also think that a lot of people new to turntables look at this table and think, "this table is considered 'the best' (again, by people who don't know much about turntables), therefore direct drive, 'S' shaped tone arms, and bells and whistles are preferable." when we know this isn't the case.

 

I'm very much with you on most of that and although a suspended belt drive is my preference it doesn't mean it's best or that direct drive with an S arm is bad. I've got pretty much most variations on the basic turntable here which includes the ubiquitous SL1200 and also another couple of normal direct drive Japanese S arm tables that are quite a bit better than the 3 or 400 a go belt drive tables that you are supposed to buy and an SL1200 for that matter.

 

The bottom line is that good engineering is good engineering and it costs but not the $4000 being asked for the new Sl1200 and conversely better than an old Sl1200 can be had for less than the £250 to £300 an average 2nd hand SL1200 costs. If it wasn't for the bullshit and hype that follows them around an average condition one should be in the £50 to £100 range and no more.

 

The other thing to consider is that the average SL1200 buyer quite often doesn't have the speakers, amplifier, phono stage or cartridge to get the very best out of a standard SL1200 so that extra £200 wasted on the turntable could be better spent somewhere else in the system.

 

A great turntable needs to spin a record at an accurate speed consistently, allow the stylus to run accurately in a decreasing angle circular groove with no outside forces or vibrations acting on it and to add no mechanical or electrical noise to the output of the motor generator that the stylus acts on. Not as difficult as it sounds to a point that is pleasing to the ear but there are quite an array of ways to do it which I think is what I love about the turntable as a thing over say a CD player because the mechanical aspect of a CD player doesn't have anywhere the same level of influence over the sound.

 

What I dislike a lot though in hifi are products that command a price way above their performance level because of marketing or hype and there's quite a few of them.

[slinch]