VPI makes world's first 3D pritned tonearm...

[isavedlatin54]

we are all yellllinngggggggg!

 

 

 

 

...sorry.

[ajxd]

[xxmartinxx]

I didn't think anything was out of the question. NO ONE SAID THIS. Your reading comprehension is horrible. For 38 you seem to have a lot of hostility on message boards. I hope in 10 years I'm not like you.

 

My reading comprehension is horrible says the guy who missed the fact I said I owned a VPI product and thought I was calling their products overpriced.

 

You said you were "excited" by it, which implies, at least to me, some element of surprise. The ability to make a plastic tonearm doesn't excite me and I don't quite understand why it would excite anyone.  Every crappy turntable has a plastic tonearm.  (EDIT: Staving off your poor reading comprehended response before we hopefully get there...  Yes, crappy tonearms are crappy because of their design not necessarily the material, but the means to make a well designed tonearm out of plastic is not new.  Why do we care that VPI made one, regardless of the means by which it was created?  Yes, 3D printers are cool.  And?)

 

Yes, I'm extremely hostile, not just here, but messageboards everwhere.  I'm so angry.  Since you know so much about me based on a few posts regarding a plastic 3D printed tonearm it's reasonable to conclude you should hope to not be like me in a decade.  I get it.  Anyone who has an opinion that runs counter to yours is probably an asshole.

[ajxd]

My reading comprehension is horrible says the guy who missed the fact I said I owned a VPI product and thought I was calling their products overpriced.

 

You said you were "excited" by it, which implies, at least to me, some element of surprise. The ability to make a plastic tonearm doesn't excite me and I don't quite understand why it would excite anyone.  Every crappy turntable has a plastic tonearm.  (EDIT: Staving off your poor reading comprehended response before we hopefully get there...  Yes, crappy tonearms are crappy because of their design not necessarily the material, but the means to make a well designed tonearm out of plastic is not new.  Why do we care that VPI made one, regardless of the means by which it was created?  Yes, 3D printers are cool.  And?)

 

Yes, I'm extremely hostile, not just here, but messageboards everwhere.  I'm so angry.  Since you know so much about me based on a few posts regarding a plastic 3D printed tonearm it's reasonable to conclude you should hope to not be like me in a decade.  I get it.  Anyone who has an opinion that runs counter to yours is probably an asshole.

 

You've proved my point, again.

[bearchuck]

Do I own one?  No.  Do I know someone who owns one?  Yes.  Have I see it work?  No, but I've seen the end result.  That has nothing to do with how new the technology is.  You can ask the same question of "tube receivers" and get a similar result. 

 

I have no idea how much VPI spent on this, but do a Google search on ZCorp 3D printers and what they run. 

 

VPI's current least expensive tone arm is $1,000.  Most people's turntable budget is 10% of that.  They'd still have to buy the table and a cartridge.  If VPI wants to make a cheaper plastic tonearm, why not make one by conventional means?  It makes no sense.  3D printers only make sense for on the fly one offs or prototyping. 

 

So googling a random 3-D printer company is seriously the basis of your argument here?  

 

Honestly, I really can't tell what your argument is any more, but it's apparent that you're extremely loose with facts and have little understanding of the role that a good tonearm plays in the grand scheme of things, not to mention the fact that you're unable to grasp the significance of what this could mean for high-end audio and the consumer.

 

Also, you can construct an awesome tonearm from numerous materials: aluminum, carbon figber, stainless steel, wood, acrylic and yes, plastic.  Hell, you could make one from a pile of dog shit, so long as that arm was extremely rigid and well-damped.

 

You said you were "excited" by it, which implies, at least to me, some element of surprise. The ability to make a plastic tonearm doesn't excite me and I don't quite understand why it would excite anyone.  Every crappy turntable has a plastic tonearm.  (EDIT: Staving off your poor reading comprehended response before we hopefully get there...  Yes, crappy tonearms are crappy because of their design not necessarily the material, but the means to make a well designed tonearm out of plastic is not new.  Why do we care that VPI made one, regardless of the means by which it was created?  Yes, 3D printers are cool.  And?)

 

Again, you're completely missing the point.  It's not about making a cheap plastic tonearm to appeal to the masses ... especially not the kids with a turntable budget of $100.  Rather, it has to do with making a great-sounding, extremely well-designed, finely tuned precision instrument with a nascent technology that may one day allow VPI and other turntable companies to produce said tonearm in large quantities at a relatively affordable price.    

 

And if it's so easy to design an excellent plastic tonearm, don't you think someone would have done it already?  The only thing I can think of that comes close to that description is the Scheu Cantus.

 

Go ahead and stick your head in the sand and believe whatever you want.  At the end of the day, VPI has done something completely unprecedented with design, materials, technology, implication and performance.  No amount of half-assed googling is going to change that.

[slinch]

Nice.  What kind of cart are you using with that.

 

Grabbed a Grado Silver to keep me going while searching for a MC cart/phono combo that'll really impress me. That grado punches above it's weight though. Wanted to go for the gold, but would have to wait a week for it and I was impatient.

 

To everything else in this thread, at the moment I don't see it a viable scenario that a company would make a cheaper but good sounding product and decide to sell it for less. What I'm trying to say is that in high-end audio prices are set by the end result (or higher of course), not by the production cost. So if the "y" product is on par with the "x" product, but at 20% of the cost, I'd expect (and it is a common practice today) that the price difference between the two would be maybe 5% and not 50% or more.

 

But who knows, trends are always changing.

[bearchuck]

To everything else in this thread, at the moment I don't see it a viable scenario that a company would make a cheaper but good sounding product and decide to sell it for less. What I'm trying to say is that in high-end audio prices are set by the end result (or higher of course), not by the production cost. So if the "y" product is on par with the "x" product, but at 20% of the cost, I'd expect (and it is a common practice today) that the price difference between the two would be maybe 5% and not 50% or more.

 

I agree that at the end of the day, most companies will place a premium price on a premium-sounding product, but there's a direct correlation between higher costs and better materials, engineering, design, execution, etc etc.

 

In other words, you pay more to get better-made equipment, and you assume that its going to sound better ... and in many cases that's true.  However, there's plenty of gear on the low end of the price spectrum that punches well above its weight, not to mention high end equipment that disappoints.  It's always been my experience that cost is only a partial indication of the end result, and numbers often lie.

 

My point with VPI and the 3-D printed tonearm is that the design, technology, implementation, etc etc is going to open a lot of doors in the future.  If it really sounds as great as has been reported, then I'm sure that there will be a cost associated with that.  But given VPI's sterling reputation and dedication to its customers. it's safe to assume that they'll also pass on any savings based on materials and shrinking production costs.

[xxmartinxx]

So googling a random 3-D printer company is seriously the basis of your argument here?  

 

Honestly, I really can't tell what your argument is any more, but it's apparent that you're extremely loose with facts and have little understanding of the role that a good tonearm plays in the grand scheme of things, not to mention the fact that you're unable to grasp the significance of what this could mean for high-end audio and the consumer.

 

Also, you can construct an awesome tonearm from numerous materials: aluminum, carbon figber, stainless steel, wood, acrylic and yes, plastic.  Hell, you could make one from a pile of dog shit, so long as that arm was extremely rigid and well-damped.

 

 

Again, you're completely missing the point.  It's not about making a cheap plastic tonearm to appeal to the masses ... especially not the kids with a turntable budget of $100.  Rather, it has to do with making a great-sounding, extremely well-designed, finely tuned precision instrument with a nascent technology that may one day allow VPI and other turntable companies to produce said tonearm in large quantities at a relatively affordable price.    

 

And if it's so easy to design an excellent plastic tonearm, don't you think someone would have done it already?  The only thing I can think of that comes close to that description is the Scheu Cantus.

 

Go ahead and stick your head in the sand and believe whatever you want.  At the end of the day, VPI has done something completely unprecedented with design, materials, technology, implication and performance.  No amount of half-assed googling is going to change that.

 

"Half assed" Googling is better what you did, which was just make shit up.  I actually asked my friend what kind of printer he works with.

 

What is the significance of this?  Please, tell me?  And don't tell me it allows VPI to mass produce plastic tone arms inexpensively, because it's not true.  It can also be done much quicker and less expensive with conventional methods.  Again, this becomes interesting when a 3D printer costs $1,000 and you can download a CAD file and print your own tonearm from home but what does the 3D printer bring to the equation for a manufacturer? 

 

With that, I am done with this conversation.  It's going no where, it's no longer interesting, and since neither of you two have coherent arguments your posts are devolving into insults.

[xxmartinxx]

Grabbed a Grado Silver to keep me going while searching for a MC cart/phono combo that'll really impress me. That grado punches above it's weight though. Wanted to go for the gold, but would have to wait a week for it and I was impatient.

 

 

Nice.  I used to use a Gold on my VPI for years.  It sounded really great but I ended up moving on to a Denon DL-160 because I found it didn't do distorted guitars as well as I would have liked.  I sort of thought it was due to the jittery nature of the Grado and the extremely light tonearm.  The Denon does "rock" better, but it's definitely missing a certain magic that the Grado had with acoustic and hip hop music.  I think when I replace the Denon, I might try a Silver.

[bearchuck]

OH MY FUCKING GOD. AM I BEING TROLLED?

 

It's like ramming my head against a 3-D printed brick wall.  Actually, that would less painful and far more enlightening.

[ajxd]

There's no way trolls live to be 38. Remember, he's not a kid.

[xxmartinxx]

I'm not 38.  Stellar reading comprehension, as usual.

[ajxd]

RIP SOON GUY

[xxmartinxx]

Thanks!

[ajxd]

With that, I am done with this conversation.

What a tease.

[xxmartinxx]

Not quite done...

 

http://www.cubify.com/

 

Want.

[ajxd]

That's not too bad price wise. But seeing a 90% hollow Les Paul style guitar made me cringe.

[xxmartinxx]

Yeah, those guitars are neat, but they likely play and sound like crap. 

[KnockKnock]

Those guitars would be some sweet, sweet wall art. 

[slinch]

Just got an email for a preorder for the VPI JMW Classic 3D Tonearm.

 

http://www.elusivedisc.com/VPI-JMW-CLASSIC-3D-TONEARM-ARMWAND/productinfo/HW-JMWCLS3DW/&utm_source=email&utm_medium=special

 

This is just the armwand, to replace the existing one. The whole package with the base costs a bit more:

 

http://www.elusivedisc.com/VPI-JMW-CLASSIC-3D-TONEARM-WITH-VTA-BASE/productinfo/HW-JMWCLS3D/&utm_source=email&utm_medium=special

 

Not the cheapest option to say the least. Only time will tell I guess.

[octave]

I hate the way the little lift arm thing looks.

[slinch]

For it's price I'd just get a CA TT3 and be done with it.

 

[bluedeni]

That tonearm is insane!

[xxmartinxx]

http://www.elusivedisc.com/VPI-JMW-CLASSIC-3D-TONEARM-WITH-VTA-BASE/productinfo/HW-JMWCLS3D/

[slinch]

^ Post #45