Heavens - Patent Pending LP up for pre-order now.

[magalvsr13]

it's almost more of a piece of art than your average record

ha!

[jhulud]

What a cop-out...

Whatever...I'm over it...this is what we're getting and no use to bitch and moan anymore about it...

[Guest scriptedrain]

it's almost more of a piece of art than your average record

ha!

Yeah... :

[magalvsr13]

i like how he constantly backs away from admitting any fault...everything is going according to plan.

and hes so surprised people are upset!

fool

[sgoodcore]

Heads Up:

He deleted the MySpace post about the vinyl. It had 3 comments against the artwork. I don't have the comment I left since he deleted it, but this was his response to me:

"Just to start, I'm writing this email in a very happy and zen matter...but who spent $18? The record was $15.99...minus $3.50 for shipping and the box it came in. I pay $9.99 for 12"s that usually only have two songs on it with absolutely no artwork. I designed the sticker, put it on the dj sleeve and hand numbered it. It's not like a label put it out, it's almost more of a piece of art than your average record. Since there's only 1000 of them and there's no way I would ever deal with the hassle putting out this record was ever again it might become collectable. Sell it on ebay in a year when Alkaline Trio's major label debut comes out!

He just keeps becoming a bigger douche by the minute.

[xfedaykinx]

what a total jerk

[counterfiction]

Heads Up:

He deleted the MySpace post about the vinyl. It had 3 comments against the artwork. I don't have the comment I left since he deleted it, but this was his response to me:

"Just to start, I'm writing this email in a very happy and zen matter...but who spent $18? The record was $15.99...minus $3.50 for shipping and the box it came in. I pay $9.99 for 12"s that usually only have two songs on it with absolutely no artwork. I designed the sticker, put it on the dj sleeve and hand numbered it. It's not like a label put it out, it's almost more of a piece of art than your average record. Since there's only 1000 of them and there's no way I would ever deal with the hassle putting out this record was ever again it might become collectable. Sell it on ebay in a year when Alkaline Trio's major label debut comes out!

He just keeps becoming a bigger douche by the minute.

wow, sent the EXACT same message to me.

[Guest scriptedrain]

He just keeps becoming a bigger douche by the minute.

wow, sent the EXACT same message to me.

While it should surprise me, it doesn't.

[xunspokenliesx]

Dude needs to own up to everything and just admit he dropped the ball...I'm pretty sure that would alleviate most of the tension felt by people...

[Guest scriptedrain]

Dude needs to own up to everything and just admit he dropped the ball...I'm pretty sure that would alleviate most of the tension felt by people...

It'd be a good start.

[sgoodcore]

Dude needs to own up to everything and just admit he dropped the ball...I'm pretty sure that would alleviate most of the tension felt by people...

It'd be a good start.

He's not going to because that could lead to people pestering him for refunds and rightfully so.

[googlemyass]

im never ordering from him again, the only reason i ordered this is because i like alk3. all of josiahs other bands have been shitty.

[flood]

yeah im really certain than an artist of a stature like matt skiba can't pick the fucking artwork for his records at this point in his career. Who the fuck needed to market this album? skiba could shit on toast and it would sell at least 10,000 copies.

[sgoodcore]

yeah im really certain than an artist of a stature like matt skiba can't pick the fucking artwork for his records at this point in his career. Who the fuck needed to market this album? skiba could shit on toast and it would sell at least 10,000 copies.

A good point. Also, the Appleseed Record I just put out was my first wanderings in to releasing vinyl and it was cake. I don't get what would be such a hassle.

[recordsyeah]

This guy is being a cheap fucker. dj sleeves in by the 1000 gotta cost 20 cent each. and the stickers like another 10 cents.

[counterfiction]

yeah im really certain than an artist of a stature like matt skiba can't pick the fucking artwork for his records at this point in his career. Who the fuck needed to market this album? skiba could shit on toast and it would sell at least 10,000 copies.

yeah, and then after the copies were sold they would go on eBay for tons and tons of cash, even though there are 10,000 out there

[ryanwood]

how funny would it be if everyone who ordered it within the past month in a half started filing paypal claims against him when they got the record

[googlemyass]

how funny would it be if everyone who ordered it within the past month in a half started filing paypal claims against him when they got the record

he'd get PWND. it needs to be done.

[meltothecore]

Ok I just read this whole thread I ordered this vinyl back in August or maybe even July? Im for Australia so when I paid for it I just got the paypal receipt aswell, so I just waited until he posted updates on myspace and that was pretty rare, so I think about 6 weeks ago I sent him an email asking what the deal was, I got no reply.

I deal with people all the time that buy stuff from our Webstore and if there is a problem I try my hardest to reply back to them asap unless Im on the road which is alittle harder but 98% of the time Im on the ball with orders and whatnot.

I cant for the life of me understand why he just didnt bother contacting anyone and whatever, its been 4 months nearly and I havent got my record yet, I have read that alot of you have received yours and I saw that most of you live in the USA, Im from Australia so Im guessing I wont be getting mine before Xmas.

Lame!

[skumbucket]

I pay $9.99 for 12"s that usually only have two songs on it with absolutely no artwork. I designed the sticker, put it on the dj sleeve and hand numbered it. It's not like a label put it out, it's almost more of a piece of art than your average record. Since there's only 1000 of them and there's no way I would ever deal with the hassle putting out this record was ever again it might become collectable. Sell it on ebay in a year when Alkaline Trio's major label debut comes out

so the douche bag overpays for his records...and that means we should too? nice fucking logic.

also, if "art" is what you're really concerned with, don't try to completely divorce yourself from a piece of art you were the driving force behind. another post said he didn't even like the album; if you haven't been happy with ANY facet of the release, why fucking bother putting out the vinyl? oh, that's right, because you're exposing yourself for the money-hungry cash-grubber that you are.

i wish i could let this go, but this guy keeps showing how much of a total dick he really is.

[googlemyass]

I pay $9.99 for 12"s that usually only have two songs on it with absolutely no artwork. I designed the sticker, put it on the dj sleeve and hand numbered it. It's not like a label put it out, it's almost more of a piece of art than your average record. Since there's only 1000 of them and there's no way I would ever deal with the hassle putting out this record was ever again it might become collectable. Sell it on ebay in a year when Alkaline Trio's major label debut comes out

so the douche bag overpays for his records...and that means we should too? nice fucking logic.

also, if "art" is what you're really concerned with, don't try to completely divorce yourself from a piece of art you were the driving force behind. another post said he didn't even like the album; if you haven't been happy with ANY facet of the release, why fucking bother putting out the vinyl? oh, that's right, because you're exposing yourself for the money-hungry cash-grubber that you are.

i wish i could let this go, but this guy keeps showing how much of a total dick he really is.

agreed. i hate him.

[dietrootbeer]

you guys make it seem like everyone who bought this on vinyl hates it. think about how many hundreds hes sold already... and then think about how many of that are board members. im thinking MAYBE 30 people TOPS. i bet the only people (or majority of) hes hearing this shit from is from vc board members. i doubt its really bothering him that much. MOST PEOPLE WOULD JUST BE HAPPY TO HAVE IT ON VINYL (including myself). ITS GOING TO SOUND THE SAME REGARDLESS OF WHAT PACKAGING IT COMES IN.

i dont know why i even try to reason with people about this album. i feel like ive written the same message 20 times. never gonna get it...

[magalvsr13]

you guys make it seem like everyone who bought this on vinyl hates it. think about how many hundreds hes sold already... and then think about how many of that are board members. im thinking MAYBE 30 people TOPS. i bet the only people (or majority of) hes hearing this shit from is from vc board members. i doubt its really bothering him that much. MOST PEOPLE WOULD JUST BE HAPPY TO HAVE IT ON VINYL (including myself). ITS GOING TO SOUND THE SAME REGARDLESS OF WHAT PACKAGING IT COMES IN.

i dont know why i even try to reason with people about this album. i feel like ive written the same message 20 times. never gonna get it...

you can't reason with peoples opinions.

you like it.

i dont.

end of story.

[dietrootbeer]

you guys make it seem like everyone who bought this on vinyl hates it. think about how many hundreds hes sold already... and then think about how many of that are board members. im thinking MAYBE 30 people TOPS. i bet the only people (or majority of) hes hearing this shit from is from vc board members. i doubt its really bothering him that much. MOST PEOPLE WOULD JUST BE HAPPY TO HAVE IT ON VINYL (including myself). ITS GOING TO SOUND THE SAME REGARDLESS OF WHAT PACKAGING IT COMES IN.

i dont know why i even try to reason with people about this album. i feel like ive written the same message 20 times. never gonna get it...

you can't reason with peoples opinions.

you like it.

i dont.

end of story.

fair enough. it just blows my mind how irrational people are being.

[scottheisel]

fair enough. it just blows my mind how irrational people are being.

Since you never responded to this post in the other Heavens thread, maybe you will here:

Let's do a timeline on this entire process.

• 
  [*:bjbkk5oj]July 20 - preorders go up through the Number Nine Sounds myspace page (which no longer exists) for $15.99ppd, with promises of the record being "limited to 1000" and "hand-numbered." A release date of Aug. 21 is set by the label. After payment is made by myself and many other people, ZERO COMMUNICATION is received from N9S/Joe Steinbrick. No order confirmation, no receipt, no anything.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]August 21 - no records.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]August 24 - jhulud emails N9S asking where the records are; N9S says the record will be delayed a few weeks due to an error at the pressing plant.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]September 7 - Still no records. N9S deletes the original blog entry about the release of the record and simply posts that the records will be delayed three more weeks. At this point, it is impossible to get a refund via Paypal for anyone who ordered right when the record was made available, as that has to happen within 45 days of the transaction.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]September 14 - Joe sends out a bulletin on the N9S account and says he's going to delete the N9S MySpace page, but not before telling everyone he's "hoping" for an Oct. 1 ship date and saying "this is your last chance to ask questions through this page." He also posts the rejected Heavens test pressings on eBay at this time.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]September 16 - N9S MySpace is deleted, thereby making it impossible to ask him any questions.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]September 18 - the test presses sell for close to $200 total. Still, no one has their records.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]October 29 - nearly six weeks after his last communication, Joe posts something on the Heavens myspace blog apologizing for the delay. He also says that he will receive the records on Nov. 2 and begin shipping immediately.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 1 - Joe confirms he has the records and will start shipping them at a rate of "100 per day" after numbering and stickering them all (keep in mind, this is the first mention of a "sticker" anywhere, and up to this point there has been zero discussion of the record's packaging).
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 2 - Joe launches a bullshit contest to get people to promote the record's release instead of packaging them up and mailing them out.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 6 - Virgil is able to obtain 100 copies of the record from Joe and sells them for a CHEAPER PRICE. Of course, those of us who faithfully pre-ordered get fucked. Also, still no records.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 16 - It's discovered that Joe is selling two more test presses on eBay (which he makes another $100 from). Still no records.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 19 - Virgil says Joe has promised him 100 more copies of the album. Still no records.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 24 - FINALLY, someone receives their record (kyle), over four months after pre-ordering with virtually no public communication from the seller in between (and zero seller-to-buyer communication, either). This is the first time anyone hears about the minimal packaging.
  [*:bjbkk5oj]November 28 - Joe calls Virgil and tells him that he is just now shipping the 200 copies Virgil has already sold on his behalf, even though Joe has had them in hand for nearly a month; Virgil won't be able to start shipping them until approximately next Monday when they arrive. This makes Virgil/Vinyl Collective look like an unreputable company, as he's already taken money from 200 people but has no product to sell them.
  

Joe himself admitted he had sold 500 of the 1000 copies in his Oct. 29 update, meaning he had pulled in approximately $8000 from orders (more if they were international). I'll assume Virgil paid $7 wholesale per copy, meaning Joe's made another $1400 off those. Factor in the $300 he's made off test pressings, and he's pocketed almost $9000 BEFORE EVER SENDING A RECORD OUT. The total is most likely larger, given as how we don't know how many he's sold between Oct. 29 and now through the Heavens myspace (and it's possible Virgil paid more wholesale, too).

I don't know where he pressed the record, but Pirates Press currently offers a quote of $2200 for 1000 LPs (virgin vinyl/full sleeves), so one would think he paid less since the product is of a lesser quality (we'll just say $2000 flat). Obviously "packaging" costs were minimal (what's a box Sharpies cost nowadays, $3.29?) and considering how few people have received their records thus far, I bet he's shipping Media Mail, meaning if all 500 copies he sold himself thus far are being shipped in the U.S., that's only $1500 (I don't know how much packing material costs, unfortunately; I always just use recycled mailers when I send stuff out).

So based on my numbers, he's looking at $3500-4000 in expenses, and a MINIMUM of $9000 pulled in, most likely more.

In closing, FTG (Fuck This Guy). If you don't think those of us who paid for this record, especially early on in the process, have reason to be upset, then I don't know how else to convince you.