MLB Discussion

[sgoodcore]

he had the second highest fielding % for a shortstop in the AL in 08. i knew people would jump on me for saying hes one of the best; he has 3 gold gloves putting him 7th on the list for SS, he has a career fielding % of .975. most of the people who argue to no end that he's a horrible defensive player are the people who prescribe to sabermetrics, which is a stupid practice/theory in my opinion.

We're talking about Jeter here right? Dude is one of the all around best shortstops to ever play the game. First ballot HOF.

Over-rated, clap, clap, clap clap clap. If the dude hadn't been on stellar teams, he was a part sure but there were other guys who helped the Yankers win, he wouldn't even been put in the same sentence as HOF. Whatever, though I don't begrudge the guy a place in Cooperstown but he's never been a great fielder, ever.

There's often a reason a dude dives for a ball and its as much to do with him not getting to the ball as it does needing to dive to extend range.

[mediocore]

There's no way in hell anyone with a functioning brain could ever consider Derek Sanderson Jeter to be on of the top defensive shortstops of all-time.

EVER.

E-V-E-R.

(Hell, he's not even the best shortstop on his own team! See: Rodriguez, Alex.)

And there is no way anyone should ever use Gold Gloves as the primary argument to prove someone's value as a "great" defensive player. Just look at the list this year... most of the winners were picked based on either A.) name recognition, B.) an offensive breakout combined with a decent defensive year, and/or C.) inertia (i.e., if you win one, you've got a damn good chance to win multiple, probably in a row). (And sometimes scenario "D" comes into play, where it's a make-up for a previous year when they should've won.)

He's definitely a solid hitter. He's won four championships. And he plays for the Yankees. So there's a good chance he'll make the HOF. But you can be damn sure it won't be based on any meaningful defensive metrics.

[travis]

This thread I started makes me hate stats. Jeter is great player. He might not be the greatest defensive shortstop of all time but whatever. If anyone thinks he isnt going to the HOF first ballot then your insane. Its not like Im partial to Jeter either. I fucking hate the Yankees. The guy is a great baseball player tho.

[dynamitekid]

no one is questioning the fact that Jeter is a GREAT PLAYER. he is. He's just not a very good defensive player.

[sgoodcore]

Here's an easy argument against a stat, namely fielding percentage:

Person A: 10 balls hit right at someone, of which they get 10. 100% fielding percentage.

Person B: 20 balls hit 5 feet to left and 5 feet to right, 10 right at them, person B gets 19 of those balls. 98% fielding percentage.

Now who's the better fielder? Person B seems to get to more balls than person A. However, the fielding percent seems to suggest person A is the better fielder.

[forgeagain]

Fielding percentage is kids' stuff. You can go the whole season without an error but that doesn't mean shit if you can't get to the balls that most players would. As long as you make the max effort it doesn't count against you. I think I saw in ONE GAME where Ryan Braun made 3 or 4 absolutely horrible plays in LF that cost the team a shitload of runs, all on routine balls that a good outfielder would have handled. Yet he received 0 errors somehow.

Jeter is an excellent player overall, and sure, he will probably be a first ballot hall-of-famer for a number of reasons, but his glove his not at the top of that list. Shit, he isn't even the best defensive SS on the team. He is getting older, his skills are declining....of course you have to consider moving him to another position if you feel you need to keep him on the team.

By the way, the Yankees pretty much stole Nick Swisher. It's a great trade for them. Wilson Betemit sucks dick. Maybe that pitching prospect is good, but man, the Sox gave up on the Swish very quickly. They should have traded Thome, Dye, or Konerko before him.

[Duff]

im tired of trying to defend him, in my mind hes one of the best, and for the record i never said the best. nothing will change my mind on that.

[Duff]

the angels said they will let k-rod go.

[travis]

the angels said they will let k-rod go.

Yea I dont think they were ever too worried about him staying or not. They are focused on Tex and if/when they sign him they will move on and worry about pitching. I think Frankie may have peaked early.

[Duff]

theyre probably betting on this past season will be his best and he want be able to duplicate the success he's had.

[mediocore]

theyre probably betting on this past season will be his best and he want be able to duplicate the success he's had.

Last season was actually one of his worst... he's on the decline, which is probably why they aren't willing to spend a shit ton of money on a long-term deal.

[Duff]

he earned the most saves in a single season in 08, so what made it his worst? ERA, strikeouts, walks, or hits wise? im not familiar with his stats other than the saves record. but i think he has peaked though. and apparently the yankees offer to sabathia is $40 million more than any other team so far

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

he earned the most saves in a single season in 08, so what made it his worst? ERA, strikeouts, walks, or hits wise? im not familiar with his stats other than the saves record. but i think he has peaked though. and apparently the yankees offer to sabathia is $40 million more than any other team so far

his velocity has been declining and his curve doesn't have the snap it used too.

[forgeagain]

The "save" is one of the stupidest stats by which to judge a pitcher, second only to wins.

[mediocore]

he earned the most saves in a single season in 08, so what made it his worst? ERA, strikeouts, walks, or hits wise? im not familiar with his stats other than the saves record. but i think he has peaked though. and apparently the yankees offer to sabathia is $40 million more than any other team so far

Yeah, his strikeout rate has been declining, his walks are still way up, and batters are getting better swings off of him.

Just not worth the cash unless you're a team like the Yankees who will spend no matter what.

[mediocore]

FJM = done.

Fuck

[sgoodcore]

Well that sucks. Want to start FAB.com? (Fire All Broadcasters)

[mediocore]

Apparently the Yankees have made an offer to CC and are planning and making offers to Burnett and Lowe as well.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3703112

[travis]

he earned the most saves in a single season in 08, so what made it his worst? ERA, strikeouts, walks, or hits wise? im not familiar with his stats other than the saves record. but i think he has peaked though. and apparently the yankees offer to sabathia is $40 million more than any other team so far

Yeah, his strikeout rate has been declining, his walks are still way up, and batters are getting better swings off of him.

Just not worth the cash unless you're a team like the Yankees who will spend no matter what.

KRod is still really young and will make a very very good closer for someone next year. I dont think he will ever have another season like he did last year but he is easily one of the best in the game right now. I think it would be stupid to write him off already. The guy does walk a lot of people and is prone to getting hit once in a while but he is still one of the best in the game.

[mediocore]

Yeah, his strikeout rate has been declining, his walks are still way up, and batters are getting better swings off of him.

Just not worth the cash unless you're a team like the Yankees who will spend no matter what.

KRod is still really young and will make a very very good closer for someone next year. I dont think he will ever have another season like he did last year but he is easily one of the best in the game right now. I think it would be stupid to write him off already. The guy does walk a lot of people and is prone to getting hit once in a while but he is still one of the best in the game.

Not saying he sucks or he's done or anything... just that he likely isn't worth the amount of cash someone's going to shell out.

Of course, there aren't many teams that even really need a closer, so his odds of getting a shit ton of money are getting slimmer by the day.

[Duff]

the expectations are going to be so high for krod that he wont be able to live up to them. someone is going to pay him, and probably too much. the mets will probably land him just to make their fans happy.

[travis]

Yea I was thinking he will probably end up with the Mets too

[shanehennessey]

Anything is better than Billy Wagner, he's god awful. I've never seen a pitcher blow more games than him...and he did it in the all star game this year.

The Yankees is where pitchers go to die. Later CC.

[crime]

the offer the yankees threw at cc is the exact reason why i hate the yankees. instead of trying to develop some talent in their farm system they just throw these huge contracts at players and try to buy a winning team.

if cc ends up taking the deal i hope he goes to ny and completely shits the bed. although i remember reading an interview with him and he said he wanted to stay in the nl.

[flood]

the offer the yankees threw at cc is the exact reason why i hate the yankees. instead of trying to develop some talent in their farm system they just throw these huge contracts at players and try to buy a winning team.

if cc ends up taking the deal i hope he goes to ny and completely shits the bed. although i remember reading an interview with him and he said he wanted to stay in the nl.

yes because the vast majority of the core of the team aren't homegrown..

every team that's competitive year in and year out "buy" players.. i'm sick of people just saying its the yankees. and besides the yanks, unlike alot of teams go out of their way to give their fans, who pay a ton of money to see their team play, the best team possible...