Speaker/Receiver Question

[stillunderoath]

I just picked up a Kenwood KD-35R turntable and I am looking for a solid receiver with phono input built in as well as some decent speakers. I've come across these:

Speakers:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004MEWZE4/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&smid=A3DRD2WX13H6ZQ

Receiver:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000MBUSD6/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?ie=UTF8&smid=A3HXWER1CPLV7Q

Are these decent? I am open to suggestions.

[slinch]

Get this:

http://www.amazon.com/PYLE-PRO-PP444-Compact-Turntable-Preamp/dp/B004HJ1TTQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1343595438&sr=1-2&keywords=phono+preamp

and a pair of active speakers, like:

http://www.amazon.com/M-Audio-Studiophile-Powered-Monitor-Speakers/dp/B0051WAM64/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1343595267&sr=1-1&keywords=m+audio

or

http://www.amazon.com/Audioengine-Premium-Powered-Desktop-Speakers/dp/B000VKEFN2/ref=sr_1_10?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1343595332&sr=1-10&keywords=powered+speakers

You'll be doing your ears a big favour.

[stillunderoath]

Get this:

http://www.amazon.co...ds=phono preamp

and a pair of active speakers, like:

http://www.amazon.co...eywords=m audio

or

http://www.amazon.co...owered speakers

You'll be doing your ears a big favour.

with that preamp do i need to get a receiver as well or can i just hook up the speakers directly to the preamp?

[slinch]

This is all you need. Active speakers have their own amplification, so all you need to add is a phono pre-amp and you're good to go.

[gabpower]

I would personnally prefer the classic method of a Stereo Receiver and Passive Speakers.

The second method would work but quality-wise I have my doubts. A $20 preamp seems pretty cheap but I don't know the model the other offered. Active speakers are not my thing either except for partys outside, I beleive most of them are not that quiet on the noise when there's no signal but I have not had many of them.

You could score some good cheap vintage receiver/speakers at garage sales for $30. It did the trick for me for one or two years then I upgraded.

[cymbalism15]

Get this:

http://www.amazon.com/PYLE-PRO-PP444-Compact-Turntable-Preamp/dp/B004HJ1TTQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1343595438&sr=1-2&keywords=phono+preamp

and a pair of active speakers, like:

http://www.amazon.com/M-Audio-Studiophile-Powered-Monitor-Speakers/dp/B0051WAM64/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1343595267&sr=1-1&keywords=m+audio

or

http://www.amazon.com/Audioengine-Premium-Powered-Desktop-Speakers/dp/B000VKEFN2/ref=sr_1_10?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1343595332&sr=1-10&keywords=powered+speakers

You'll be doing your ears a big favour.

I've been looking at those speakers for a while but I can't decide between the two. Also are there anymore that are better around that price range?

Also, passive vs. active. Which is better and why?

[chiefwahoo]

I used to sell stereo equipment at my uncle's shop. He's a big time audiophile but his focus was always on selling the best sounding components for the lowest price. Sherwood was our entry level line and you couldn't beat it for the money. I'm still using the Sherwood receiver I bought at the time, which is 15+ years. I'm in agreement with the first review at that link by Marvin Cohn.

"Don't expect a lot of toots and whistles; but you can expect a good solid product with performance factor that far exceeds its modest cost"

That pretty much sums it up. We also had a repair shop at the site and it was incredibly rare for Sherwood components to come back for repair, especially receivers. When they did need repaired, it was very cost effective to do so, which is another reason we carried the line. Unlike Sony, for example, which was incredibly expensive to repair.

[streetwaves]

I would go vintage (Pioneer, Marantz, Sansui). Look at Craigslist and thrift stores. New receivers can't compare to those produced in the 70s. I've picked up a couple of vintage Pioneer receivers for $25 and they easily outperform any under $500 receiver. I would go vintage on the speakers as well. Even if you have to put money into the receiver or speakers---they will last the rest of your life and I can't say that for modern components.

[ajxd]

That's not exactly true. Older components are great, but won't last forever. Look at the capcitor differences alone. These receivers from the 70s could be working great, but will eventually need an overhaul. I used to make a lot of money rebuilding old amps and receivers.

[ajxd]

Oh, and modern equipment has a bad stigma on these boards because only 5% of people actually buy good equipment. Some $200 Sony piece of crap from Best Buy isn't going to perform or last the same as a nice Rotel integrated.

[streetwaves]

That's not exactly true. Older components are great, but won't last forever. Look at the capcitor differences alone. These receivers from the 70s could be working great, but will eventually need an overhaul. I used to make a lot of money rebuilding old amps and receivers.

How many overhauls are we talking about? I have an early 70s Marantz that's never been overhauled---that's almost 40 years. I'm sure it will need caps replaced soon/at some point but even if I only get another 30 years, I'm still better off than buying something new that's under $500.

[ajxd]

How many need to be done on an amp? It will only need one, unless you take it to an under qualified person for service. If the amp was treated super well, it may never need one.

[konk]

How much does it cost? I'm still leaning towards vintage, but for new I'm seeing under $500 and $200 POS in this thread. So not sure how much I need to spend if I go new.

[ajxd]

Your post doesn't make a ton of sense. Are you asking how much a rebuild costs? If so, that's impossible to tell you. There is no standard. Every person costs different amount per hour, and every job depends on the issue.

[konk]

Yes that's what I was asking. I'm trying to compare used plus overhaul to new of equal specs, but I guess since there are no labor standards, it can't be done.

Specs may not be the right word, but you know what I mean.

[bearchuck]

Yes that's what I was asking. I'm trying to compare used plus overhaul to new of equal specs, but I guess since there are no labor standards, it can't be done.

Specs may not be the right word, but you know what I mean.

If you already own a vintage receiver and it sounds fine, keep on listening. If and when it starts giving you problems, there are knowledgeable people out there who will do the work. As long as you're not dealing with unobtainium parts, it's probably going to cost you in the $100 - $200 range. That's for a thorough overhaul: a good cleaning, as well as a recap and replacement for any other basic components (resistors, transistors, etc etc) that need it.

There are obviously exceptions and you'll never really know until you get a tech to actually take a look inside.

Of course, you have to ask yourself if the receiver is even worth restoring in the first place. If you can't resell it for the amount of money you dump into it, then think twice. If it's a high end vintage receiver or it has personal value to you - and it's something you can see yourself using for years to come - then rebuilding it might be okay. For example, I have a Sony STR-6065. I'm not even using it right now, but it's in pretty good shape. If it started giving me problems though, it would be a tough choice. It sounds terrific, it's well-regarded and it also has sentimental value, but I doubt that I could sell it for more than $200, if that.

If you're considering buying a vintage receiver / amp, then I would definitely look for one that has already been worked on. There are plenty out there and it's going to save you a lot of time and heartache in the future. You should be able to find something very nice in the $300 - $500 range.

If you can't find one, buy from a trusted seller who has obviously taken good care of his / her gear. Make sure it's working properly before committing to anything.

And just to be clear, I'm not knocking new gear either. As ajxd said, there's plenty of awesome new equipment as well. However, that doesn't usually include the Best Buy bargain aisle. Typically when audiophiles talk about "budget" amps, we're talking well north of $500. The reason I'm always suggesting vintage gear is because most VCers are young and don't have a huge disposable income. In no way am I saying that vintage is better than new, or vice versa. It's more of a "bang for your buck" thing.

[ajxd]

I have a budget integrated. It was $1000.

[bearchuck]

I have a budget integrated. It was $1000.

Exactly!

And currently I'm using a vintage Luxman L-80V integrated that I bought for $210 (including shipping). It had been worked on by a professional repair shop just a few months before I purchased it.

I love it. Of course, I love the Luxman sound, as well as the beautiful aesthetics and build quality.

Now If you did a side-by-side comparison of my integrated with ajxd's, would you notice a huge difference? I don't know ... kinda depends on the rest of the equipment and which way your tastes lean. Plenty of other stuff to factor in, but I doubt that the two would be miles apart from one another. Like I've said before, I place a ton of value on buying gear that works well together. You could drop $1000 each on an amp, preamp and speakers, but it doesn't guarantee they're a good match for one another.

At the end of the day, you have to ask yourself what's important to you. Do you want the best possible sound and money is no object? Do you want nice gear but you plan on upgrading slowly? Are you looking for the biggest bang for your buck ... or do you simply want something that's functional? There's no right or wrong answer, but it will help us better guide you if you can give us a general idea as to your intent.

[konk]

Thanks. I'd say the second one.

[bearchuck]

Thanks. I'd say the second one.

Nice gear ... upgrading slowly? If that's the case, now you have to decide if you want to go with new or vintage. With the former you have the benefit of something that will most likely be trouble-free and last you for years. It's also easier to find new gear from respectable dealers who often can provide a lot more guarantees than someone on the secondhand market. It's probably a little easier to audition gear via a dealer as well.

The cons of new ... obviously, higher price. You might want to look for slightly-used newer gear.

As for vintage, the benefits are that your dollar can go a long way. If you're looking to build an entire system, you'll reach your goal much quicker going the vintage route. And generally speaking there really is some really nice-sounding, well-built pieces out there. Some people like the aesthetics of vintage over new as well.

In the minus category is the reliability factor, not to mention that vintage equipment is generally a lot tougher to track down. Obviously eBay and Craigslist are great resources, but no doubt there's a slight sketch factor with both. I would much rather buy from someone on Audiogon or Bartertown (on Audiokarma.com).

So there ya go. If I were you, I'd start visiting the audiophile message boards and if possible, see if you can make friends with local people who might be willing to let you listen to their stuff. That's really the best way to decide what you like.