A Day To Remember Beating Up On Girls?

[selfreliable]

Jesus, people are overreacting like crazy in here. No one is bullying her. They are making fun of a band and her taste in music. She went to twitter to attack those people, they just stayed in here and kept making fun of said band. Their is a big difference in this and attacking someone because they say they are gay.

[GradedOnACurve]

Officially for the record she is a Juggalo.

[silentgods]

She got shit because she marched into a dead thread and got on her pulpit and whined about something and then got made fun of.

WELCOME TO VC.

[kriss]

Personally, I would rather listen to John Cage.

While you may or may not be taking the piss, I gotta say - if a John Cage thread ever pops up on this board in ernest (not out of a straight reaction to THIS comment), I'll upload a photo of myself trying to eat my own hat.

[scottheisel]

Personally, I would rather listen to John Cage.

While you may or may not be taking the piss, I gotta say - if a John Cage thread ever pops up on this board in ernest (not out of a straight reaction to THIS comment), I'll upload a photo of myself trying to eat my own hat.

I love Johnny Cage!

[jeyzeus809]

so stop acting like you're listening to radiohead or some shit. this is not supposed to be music like that.

I've never heard of the band that this thread is going on about, but I'm picking this particular nugget out just to ask why folks seem to consistently site Radiohead when pulling to differentiate 'fun' music from music that's supposed to be 'artistic'. They're a pop rock band who integrate more off the beaten path sounds into what is a very traditional structure - why does no one seem to understand that? I'm not hating on them by any means but c'mon - it'd be nice if folks found a better barometer when comparing lighter music and 'difficult' music as opposed to some band that's considered weird because they fold TRULY weird things (20th century avant garde, kraut rock, etc) into their musical vocabulary.

Because no one knows who they are. You understood the exact point I was trying to make when using radiohead as an example, even though you disagree with them as an "artistic" band. Fact is they're largely seen as artistic and wanted to make a point. TBH im not a big fan of them, and I agree 100% with you, but a lot of people classify them as artistic gods and don't even know most of the people you listed.

I've seen ICP live, and I've seen A Day To Remember live. ICP puts on the better show.

They have more money. ADTR just sued victory for $75,000 [Divide that between 5 dudes not sure if tom denney gets a piece] and have probably sold less than 500k records total. That includes all of their re-releases, and i'd go as far as to say vinyl as well.

ICP has sold over 6.5 million records since april 07' [probably a fuckload more now], paid 80 grand [more than what ADTR is suing for] just to get just to get some rappers on ONE of their CDs [snoop dog, old dirty bastard, and ice-t]

[all info looked up in wikipedia in 2 minutes]

Their production value is in a whole other fucking world. Its going to be a better show. I bet if ADTR made the same amount of money as ICP they'd blow them out of the water. Easy.

[controlthebleeding]

I've seen ICP live, and I've seen A Day To Remember live. ICP puts on the better show.

They have more money. ADTR just sued victory for $75,000 [Divide that between 5 dudes not sure if tom denney gets a piece] and have probably sold less than 500k records total. That includes all of their re-releases, and i'd go as far as to say vinyl as well.

ICP has sold over 6.5 million records since april 07' [probably a fuckload more now], paid 80 grand [more than what ADTR is suing for] just to get just to get some rappers on ONE of their CDs [snoop dog, old dirty bastard, and ice-t]

[all info looked up in wikipedia in 2 minutes]

Their production value is in a whole other fucking world. Its going to be a better show. I bet if ADTR made the same amount of money as ICP they'd blow them out of the water. Easy.

What does more money have to do with a band throwing a better show? that's the most asinine thing i've read in a while.

That's the equivalent to liking a bands album over another because of the packaging.

[skadaddy]

That's the equivalent to liking a bands album over another because of the packaging.

[jeyzeus809]

They have more money. ADTR just sued victory for $75,000 [Divide that between 5 dudes not sure if tom denney gets a piece] and have probably sold less than 500k records total. That includes all of their re-releases, and i'd go as far as to say vinyl as well.

ICP has sold over 6.5 million records since april 07' [probably a fuckload more now], paid 80 grand [more than what ADTR is suing for] just to get just to get some rappers on ONE of their CDs [snoop dog, old dirty bastard, and ice-t]

[all info looked up in wikipedia in 2 minutes]

Their production value is in a whole other fucking world. Its going to be a better show. I bet if ADTR made the same amount of money as ICP they'd blow them out of the water. Easy.

What does more money have to do with a band throwing a better show? that's the most asinine thing i've read in a while.

That's the equivalent to liking a bands album over another because of the packaging.

Quick anecdote: I REALLY don't like linkin park's music, but one of my best friends bought me tickets to go see them and I felt bad saying no. So i went. and as much as their music sucked, I was at least able to enjoy the show, because it sounded clear, the intro was pretty cool, and they have good stage presence.

generally speaking, ICP plays bigger and different venues, has better techs, better light shows, fire works, and bigger crowds & a lot more than just the music. this all contributes to the atmosphere. When you've been an artist as long as ICP has been one you have to do things that are really cool and out of this world to keep people interested. its marketing. they want you to tell your friends after the show how crazy the concert was, and keep you coming back for more.

fact is money can equal better shows. money does not automatically translate into better music, but it definitely can turn into a better show.

Just imagine if one of your favorite bands got a whole bunch of money and now can afford things like fireworks[or whatever you'd be interested in], better techs, better equipment, better venues with better acoustics, better instruments, the works. Chances are youd like that concert more than one at a local venue.

perfect example is glassjaw. I saw them at a secret show out here in LI, in a small lounge. Was it a great show and performance? yeah, it was a nice intimate show, but when i saw them at nassau coliseum with all their equipment, their big ass GJ flag, sick light show, daryl/justin rocking out cause they actually had stage space.....i'd be a liar if i didn't say i had more fun, and it was definitely a better show.

just my 2¢. agree to disagree if anything

[GradedOnACurve]

[Guest]

Personally, I would rather listen to John Cage.

While you may or may not be taking the piss, I gotta say - if a John Cage thread ever pops up on this board in ernest (not out of a straight reaction to THIS comment), I'll upload a photo of myself trying to eat my own hat.

Dead serious, I enjoy me some Cage, but I think it is safe to say your hat is safe for the time being.

[controlthebleeding]

What does more money have to do with a band throwing a better show? that's the most asinine thing i've read in a while.

That's the equivalent to liking a bands album over another because of the packaging.

fact is money can equal better shows. money does not automatically translate into better music, but it definitely can turn into a better show.

Just imagine if one of your favorite bands got a whole bunch of money and now can afford things like fireworks[or whatever you'd be interested in], better techs, better equipment, better venues with better acoustics, better instruments, the works. Chances are youd like that concert more than one at a local venue.

perfect example is glassjaw. I saw them at a secret show out here in LI, in a small lounge. Was it a great show and performance? yeah, it was a nice intimate show, but when i saw them at nassau coliseum with all their equipment, their big ass GJ flag, sick light show, daryl/justin rocking out cause they actually had stage space.....i'd be a liar if i didn't say i had more fun, and it was definitely a better show.

just my 2¢. agree to disagree if anything

Money can turn a good live performance into a better show, but that doesn't necessarily mean it makes a mediocre band more pleasant to listen too. basically you're saying that production value trumps good live performances. You're saying that NICKELBACK is better live than say DILLINGER ESCAPE PLAN because they have more money and play bigger venues. Which in the famous words of Bernie Mac "it makes no mutha' fuckin' sense".

Also Jawbreaker played a 175 capacity club and once they got signed and played with FOO FIGHTERS, it was not anywhere near as good as when i saw them the 4 times before in smaller venues.

Fireworks, monster lighting, huge stage, more amps, doesn't make a band better than anyone else nor does it necessarily make an experience better. Unless that's what you're into.

I'm sure when REFUSED or At THE DRIVE IN play, 98% of the people here or anywhere would rather see them in a small club than coachella. Thats a fact.

[controlthebleeding]

While you may or may not be taking the piss, I gotta say - if a John Cage thread ever pops up on this board in ernest (not out of a straight reaction to THIS comment), I'll upload a photo of myself trying to eat my own hat.

Dead serious, I enjoy me some Cage, but I think it is safe to say your hat is safe for the time being.

Dude has some melancholy songs.. which i enjoy.

[Guest]

Dead serious, I enjoy me some Cage, but I think it is safe to say your hat is safe for the time being.

Dude has some melancholy songs.. which i enjoy.

+1 for continued radness.

[kriss]

I completely agree - one of my favorite records when writing is Sonatas and Interludes. Once I was at Academy Annex and I found a used copy of his Atlas Ellipticals 4xLP - completely stoked, I sorta let out a yell and flashed it to Mellie while an older gentleman - very academic looking professor type - who was digging two rows down from me looked over and gave me this completely disgusted look at having not found it first. If you can find it, definitely track down the article that was written about him awhile back in Gastronomica about his obsession with mushrooms (morels not psychedelics) which rivaled his love for composition. Great stuff.

[controlthebleeding]

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[Guest]

YES! Another +1 for Mike and one for Kriss as soon as I can again.

[controlthebleeding]

YES! Another +1 for Mike and one for Kriss as soon as I can again.

was it the pootie tang reference that did it..

[Guest]

Yup...it was the link between Cage and Pootie that did it. Genius.

[jeyzeus809]

fact is money can equal better shows. money does not automatically translate into better music, but it definitely can turn into a better show.

Just imagine if one of your favorite bands got a whole bunch of money and now can afford things like fireworks[or whatever you'd be interested in], better techs, better equipment, better venues with better acoustics, better instruments, the works. Chances are youd like that concert more than one at a local venue.

perfect example is glassjaw. I saw them at a secret show out here in LI, in a small lounge. Was it a great show and performance? yeah, it was a nice intimate show, but when i saw them at nassau coliseum with all their equipment, their big ass GJ flag, sick light show, daryl/justin rocking out cause they actually had stage space.....i'd be a liar if i didn't say i had more fun, and it was definitely a better show.

just my 2¢. agree to disagree if anything

Money can turn a good live performance into a better show, but that doesn't necessarily mean it makes a mediocre band more pleasant to listen too. basically you're saying that production value trumps good live performances. You're saying that NICKELBACK is better live than say DILLINGER ESCAPE PLAN because they have more money and play bigger venues. Which in the famous words of Bernie Mac "it makes no mutha' fuckin' sense".

Also Jawbreaker played a 175 capacity club and once they got signed and played with FOO FIGHTERS, it was not anywhere near as good as when i saw them the 4 times before in smaller venues.

Fireworks, monster lighting, huge stage, more amps, doesn't make a band better than anyone else nor does it necessarily make an experience better. Unless that's what you're into.

I'm sure when REFUSED or At THE DRIVE IN play, 98% of the people here or anywhere would rather see them in a small club than coachella. Thats a fact.

To be honest, i think it depends on the band. For the bands you listed, i think they honestly benefit on smaller shows. I've had a lot more fun at a small envy on the coast show in a bar than one at capital 1 theater.

But to be honest, for bands like adtr and ICP... IMO they definitely benefit from a bigger budget. And you can't compare DEP and nickelback.....that's just mean to DEP.

[jblahmaster]

Damn i feel like a piece of shit, because i haven't heard much john cage. The stuff i have heard i really dig though.

Also i can somewhat agree with mike on john zorn. Some stuff i can't listen to continuously, while others like The Dreamers records, a couple records he did with Eugene Chadbourne and the Painkiller stuff i can always listen to. Then again, he has his fair share of music i have yet to delve into.

[Guest]

did yall know pootie tang was written/directed by louis ck?

[kriss]

Damn i feel like a piece of shit, because i haven't heard much john cage. The stuff i have heard i really dig though.

Also i can somewhat agree with mike on john zorn. Some stuff i can't listen to continuously, while others like The Dreamers records, a couple records he did with Eugene Chadbourne and the Painkiller stuff i can always listen to. Then again, he has his fair share of music i have yet to delve into.

Cage had such a wide range of stuff - for the more out there material, definitely check out HPSCD, a composition he put together with a harpsichord and random chance utilizing electronics and tape effects. It's really easy to fans of bands like Black Dice, Merzbow or Wolf Eyes as well as other noise labels/artists (the Not Not Fun label for example) to overlook what artists like Cage, Erik Satie, Edgar Varese, Karlheinz Stockhausen and many of the other composers of the 50's and 60's were doing because technology has caught up with them.

Back then though sans the technology of the last 20 years, they were splicing everything by hand ala collage like William S. Burroughs was talking about in his Breakthrough In Grey Room recordings - a 30 minute composition could take months and in some cases years to put together as opposed to now where an 'experimental' 'musician' (I use the quotes due to the lack of craftsmanship) can put something identical together on their Macbook in 10 minutes.

The Nonesuch label is a great place to look for old avant garde/electronic recordings - prior to being the home to more bland stuff like Wilco and The Black Keys, they were one of the leaders in the more bizarre ends of the music spectrum a good 50 years ago and almost anything involving the words 'synthesized tape' or 'composed for five voices and a tape machine' are sure to be great listening.

Sorry for the tl;dr geek out, I'm a major 20th century avant geek.

[jblahmaster]

Damn i feel like a piece of shit, because i haven't heard much john cage. The stuff i have heard i really dig though.

Also i can somewhat agree with mike on john zorn. Some stuff i can't listen to continuously, while others like The Dreamers records, a couple records he did with Eugene Chadbourne and the Painkiller stuff i can always listen to. Then again, he has his fair share of music i have yet to delve into.

Cage had such a wide range of stuff - for the more out there material, definitely check out HPSCD, a composition he put together with a harpsichord and random chance utilizing electronics and tape effects. It's really easy to fans of bands like Black Dice, Merzbow or Wolf Eyes as well as other noise labels/artists (the Not Not Fun label for example) to overlook what artists like Cage, Erik Satie, Edgar Varese, Karlheinz Stockhausen and many of the other composers of the 50's and 60's were doing because technology has caught up with them.

Back then though sans the technology of the last 20 years, they were splicing everything by hand ala collage like William S. Burroughs was talking about in his Breakthrough In Grey Room recordings - a 30 minute composition could take months and in some cases years to put together as opposed to now where an 'experimental' 'musician' (I use the quotes due to the lack of craftsmanship) can put something identical together on their Macbook in 10 minutes.

The Nonesuch label is a great place to look for old avant garde/electronic recordings - prior to being the home to more bland stuff like Wilco and The Black Keys, they were one of the leaders in the more bizarre ends of the music spectrum a good 50 years ago and almost anything involving the words 'synthesized tape' or 'composed for five voices and a tape machine' are sure to be great listening.

Sorry for the tl;dr geek out, I'm a major 20th century avant geek.

It's awesome that you mention HPSCD, because that's one of the first pieces i heard from him. When i first heard it i wasn't a big fan of the harpsichord sound, but on some weird level it dug deep for me.

I can understand what you mean pertaining to the technology catching up with the greats and fans of newer stuff overlooking them. I was like this for awhile, until i watched a documentary on frank zappa and how Edgar Varese had had a major influence on him in his composition. So i decided to go back to older Composers of the sort and am really glad i have.

Yeah i sometimes forget Nonesuch also has a bevy of amazing back catalogue from great artists, haha

It's all great though because not a lot of people on this board are really into the more abstract in things involving music and its good to know that there's some people that do love that music

[Guest]

The Nonesuch label is a great place to look for old avant garde/electronic recordings - prior to being the home to more bland stuff like Wilco and The Black Keys...

I got a chuckle out of this. +1

One of my favorite Cage quotes talks about sound and how musicians hear/play with the relationship between sounds as opposed to the sounds themselves. Blew my mind...