kriss Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 http://theconversation.edu.au/ordering-the-vegetarian-meal-theres-more-animal-blood-on-your-hands-4659 Hmm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almightyseancore Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 people going veg in protest are making no impact whatsoever, imo. they aren't killing one less cow a day because of you or anything. someone is always going to be there to eat their product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourfourtwo Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 tl;dr shortened? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriss Posted January 3, 2012 Author Share Posted January 3, 2012 The basic argument being presented - with Australian's agricultural landscape being the focus of this particular article with hints that it's a worldwide issue - is that more animal death is brought about through cultivation of grain and since vegans and vegetarians often rely on a diet heavy on grains, the article is suggesting (with a fair amount of one sided bias) that they are by their extension doing the exact opposite of what they're attempting to do (being veg in part to help eradicate animal suffering and cruelty). #cliffnotes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto802 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I have little regard for those that are vegans/vegetarians out of conscience, but full respect for those that choose the diet for health reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriss Posted January 3, 2012 Author Share Posted January 3, 2012 Why so? I know you and I have discussed it at length over the years and you know my views on it but what about those who do it for religious reasons? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto802 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Religious reasons I have no opinion over, or at least I will try not to unless they claim to have the same religious persuasion as me and are implying that I am somehow in error for not following their diet. It's difficult to argue religion with people in a productive manner, and if someone thinks "God" is "calling" them to not eat meat for whatever reason I have to let them answer that "call." On a personal and opinionated level, I think that not eating meat as way of protest or to express care for animals in general is a weak reason to risk your health and guide your life. By risk your health I am speaking of vegetarians I have known that know nothing of eating healthy and live on a diet of french fries, potato chips and mozzarella sticks. I should also note that I am suffering from a dry socket from a wisdom tooth extraction last week and am hopped up on Vicadin, so I probably shouldn't be posting at all! Please forgive my lack of inhibition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somethingvinyl Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 How come nobody argues that plants which produce veggies are living things and thus need protection? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mellietronx Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I don't find it to be a "sin" to eat meat, but the way the animals are killed is so inhumane. I also do it for health. I have more energy and believe or not...I am less anemic than I was before becoming vegan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto802 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I'm definitely looking forward to being in control of my diet more when I move out to Detroit this month. We'll be doing much of our weekly shopping at Eastern Market, which will be especially nice when the local farmers start bringing their stuff out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryq Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 How come nobody argues that plants which produce veggies are living things and thus need protection? because they don't have nervous systems? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryq Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 The basic argument being presented - with Australian's agricultural landscape being the focus of this particular article with hints that it's a worldwide issue - is that more animal death is brought about through cultivation of grain and since vegans and vegetarians often rely on a diet heavy on grains, the article is suggesting (with a fair amount of one sided bias) that they are by their extension doing the exact opposite of what they're attempting to do (being veg in part to help eradicate animal suffering and cruelty).#cliffnotes it's convenient that they focus on cows grazing in fields, rather than on, say, chickens that are stacked in cages shitting on each other oh, and it seems less "inhumane" to unintentionally kill mice and whatnot while plowing than to kill a cow by hanging it and slitting its throat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto802 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Oh yeah, I almost forgot about people that make vegan/vegetarianism into a religion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kriss Posted January 3, 2012 Author Share Posted January 3, 2012 I'm definitely looking forward to being in control of my diet more when I move out to Detroit this month. We'll be doing much of our weekly shopping at Eastern Market, which will be especially nice when the local farmers start bringing their stuff out. It was fairly simple to be vegan when we lived at JPUSA (though you know Skot - he was resistant all the way whenever I'd try to eat that way on tour), I just cooked for us the entire time. Granted I worked in the kitchen, so that made it easier. The basic argument being presented - with Australian's agricultural landscape being the focus of this particular article with hints that it's a worldwide issue - is that more animal death is brought about through cultivation of grain and since vegans and vegetarians often rely on a diet heavy on grains, the article is suggesting (with a fair amount of one sided bias) that they are by their extension doing the exact opposite of what they're attempting to do (being veg in part to help eradicate animal suffering and cruelty).#cliffnotes it's convenient that they focus on cows grazing in fields, rather than on, say, chickens that are stacked in cages shitting on each other oh, and it seems less "inhumane" to unintentionally kill mice and whatnot while plowing than to kill a cow by hanging it and slitting its throat That's partially why I linked the article. It's so one sided and so heavily biased towards one side that one can't but walk away from reading it feeling strongly one way or the other. At its root, veganism is an impossible practice. There is no such thing as a perfect vegan (for the sake of ease of reference, I call myself a vegan to those who ask my dietary preference but I'd certainly consider myself a strict vegetarian personally since I've made mistakes as have others and no one is perfect) - there are too many accidents like field mice in plowing or whatever else. The difference between those two view points is that one has an air of being deliberate while the other is striving to meet a set of rules while accepting that 100% accuracy isn't entirely possible. It's intentions really. I'm not saying that anyone is better than anyone else based off of what they eat - just noting the white elephant in the room in terms of how the article presented its case of vegans/vegetarians making a bad decision by adhering to such a lifestyle due to the inevitable casualties they cause by eating grains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jase Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 The basic argument being presented - with Australian's agricultural landscape being the focus of this particular article with hints that it's a worldwide issue - is that more animal death is brought about through cultivation of grain and since vegans and vegetarians often rely on a diet heavy on grains, the article is suggesting (with a fair amount of one sided bias) that they are by their extension doing the exact opposite of what they're attempting to do (being veg in part to help eradicate animal suffering and cruelty).#cliffnotes it's convenient that they focus on cows grazing in fields, rather than on, say, chickens that are stacked in cages shitting on each other oh, and it seems less "inhumane" to unintentionally kill mice and whatnot while plowing than to kill a cow by hanging it and slitting its throat See, that's not what I took away from that article at all. For me it(the article) was speaking about clearfelling native Forrest ad bushlands. Taking away natural habitat from the animals that lived there. In order to provide enough plant based food to feed the masses. Of course it's a moot point anyway. The world will never be 100% vegan, and it will never be 100% red meat diet. To me it just seemed like a waste of time that article being conceived in the first place. As all it amounts to is further back and forth talk about whose diet is better. It's not goin to change anyone's mind, only strengthen the views of meat eaters. As it was obviously written by a meat eater. As for respecting ones personal views, I have the utmost respect for vegans. Ethical vegetarians are hypocrites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcm1610 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Let's all agree on one thing - there'd be less methane in the air if we switched from cows to kangaroos, so we should do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SecretAgentP Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catalinacaper Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I resent vegetarians/vegans for turning food into something ideological. I'm gonna eat whatever the hell I want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryq Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Let's all agree on one thing - there'd be less methane in the air if we switched from cows to kangaroos, so we should do that. mmm... kangaroo milk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steventangent Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Let's all agree on one thing - there'd be less methane in the air if we switched from cows to kangaroos, so we should do that. fool I ain't eatin no kangaroo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igotchills Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 i'm vegetarian out of the fact that having a tofu pup sounds more enticing than a pig asshole. cultivating food, whether animals or vegetables will destroy the environment but there is absolutely no way being veg is worse the the environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kforkevin777 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I resent vegetarians/vegans for turning food into something ideological. I'm gonna eat whatever the hell I want. That's a... slightly angry, but simple way to put the way I feel. Also... No Vegan diet, no Vegan powers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mellietronx Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I try not to be pushy, but some meat eaters still harass me like I am forcing them to be vegan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riddle350 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 How come nobody argues that plants which produce veggies are living things and thus need protection? because they don't have nervous systems? Also they aren't sentient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riddle350 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I resent vegetarians/vegans for turning food into something ideological. I'm gonna eat whatever the hell I want. I view eating meat and using animal products to be just as much as an ideology as being vegetarian/vegan. Non vegans love to paint us as militant where as I would use the word passionate to describe our, at least my, position. Non vegans get incredibly defensive about food/lifestyle politics because really they have to be. It's the only way for them to not feel guilty. If you consume animal products you have to recognize that you are selfish. You have to be comfortable with the fact that your actions result in the death of sentient beings. Your actions damage the environment. Your actions harm your health. Eat/consume whatever you please but don't parade around as if you're innocent. Own up to what you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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