NHL Discussion

[murakami]

re: the goalie interference call. i agree that the ref in the picture wasnt looking at the play, but it could have been called by the other official.

side rant - i hate it when the ref 75 feet away calls a hold or a hook when the ref in the zone sees nothing wrong with the play

[swankymodes]

It was Carle who high sticked Cooke in front of the net.

As for Hartnell... he was an embarrassment last night. You love the guy because he's high energy and he can put up some points. Not many of the trouble maker players put up points like he does. But he's gotta have a fucking brain defect or something. I don't know if he was pushed or if he intentionally crashed in Fleury, and I don't really care. Next to Jordan Staal, Hartnell was the Penguins best player last night. The Flyers should bench him for the first period on Friday. Make him sit on the bench and watch in shame. You just can't afford to take all those stupid penalties during the playoffs. Especially against the Pens powerplay that scores almost 25% of the time since Gonchar came back.

The game was an embarrassment. The Pens beat up the Flyers in every aspect of the game.

I wonder if Bill Guerin was trying to impress his old lady last night when he jumped Coburn in front of the net at the end of the game? Nobody has ever accused him of being a class act for sure.

[brad]

murakami - side rant - i hate it when the ref 75 feet away calls a hold or a hook when the ref in the zone sees nothing wrong with the play

seriously - worst part of the two ref system. sometimes it feels like they are in competition with each other about who can call the most penalties

swankymodes - I wonder if Bill Guerin was trying to impress his old lady last night when he jumped Coburn in front of the net at the end of the game? Nobody has ever accused him of being a class act for sure.

at first i was like, holy shit, a real fight in the playoffs? then i saw that it was just a hug/takedown fest.

[sgoodcore]

re: the goalie interference call. i agree that the ref in the picture wasnt looking at the play, but it could have been called by the other official.

side rant - i hate it when the ref 75 feet away calls a hold or a hook when the ref in the zone sees nothing wrong with the play

They need to allow some kind of referee conference or overruling or something. I'm tired of that happening, especially when its on-the-puck play where the closer ref is actually following the play in question intently.

[drabley]

I don't think the Flyers are dirty, per se. At least not dirty in the classic Flyers sense.

I do think that they were getting manhandled for most of the game, though, and did some stupid things out of frustration/desperation.

Whether you interpret that as dirty is a personal call.

I did enjoy the Canucks/Blues game, however. Demitra's pass on the D.Sedin goal was exceptional. And that 5 on 3 kill was picture perfect. A few too many penalties for my tastes, especially for playoff hockey, but a good match none the less.

Overall, 'twas a good night. Except that Devils/Canes game. That was pretty brutal.

[swankymodes]

swankymodes - I wonder if Bill Guerin was trying to impress his old lady last night when he jumped Coburn in front of the net at the end of the game? Nobody has ever accused him of being a class act for sure.

at first i was like, holy shit, a real fight in the playoffs? then i saw that it was just a hug/takedown fest.

There should have been more fights. They just got dogged 4-1 in the playoffs. They needed to send some kind of message. The only message the Flyers sent at the end, was that they were a bunch of bitches. Not like they don't have 3 guys on the roster who can do nothing but throw hands. They should have rolled it 99-00 style, when they got put down 2 games to 1 with a 5-0 routing by the Pens in the playoffs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5n6yuzV5FHo

[swankymodes]

Mike Richards called out the team (a.k.a. Scott Hartnell) in the Daily News today.

"It's frustrating when you have momentum or you're starting to gain momentum and you're thrown back on your heels again from a penalty you don't need to take. Penalties where you're playing physical in your own end or you're trying to finish a guy or take away a scoring chance from them, OK. But it wasn't like that tonight. We were taking penalties away from the puck, away from the scoring angles. And when you do that, it just tires you out. You're blocking shots, pucks are hitting you, it tires you out.

"It's a lot harder playing defense than it is playing offense."

[kirbypuckett]

I wonder if Bill Guerin was trying to impress his old lady last night when he jumped Coburn in front of the net at the end of the game? Nobody has ever accused him of being a class act for sure.

Watch the replay of that if you can. Coburn slashes him on the legs prior to the puck dropping. So maybe Coburn was trying to impress someone...

Guerin isn't the classiest guy in the league, but what Coburn did was uncalled for.

[kirbypuckett]

The NHL will hold a hearing with Philadelphia Flyers forward Daniel Carcillo at 3 p.m. ET Thursday to discuss an incident that took place during the Flyers' Game 1 loss to the Pittsburgh Penguins, 4-1, Wednesday night.

The NHL spoke with all coaches and general managers prior to the start of the playoffs informing them there would be no "message sending" during the latter stages of games. Carcillo got involved with the Penguins' Max Talbot near the end of the game.

[swankymodes]

I wonder if Bill Guerin was trying to impress his old lady last night when he jumped Coburn in front of the net at the end of the game? Nobody has ever accused him of being a class act for sure.

Watch the replay of that if you can. Coburn slashes him on the legs prior to the puck dropping. So maybe Coburn was trying to impress someone...

Guerin isn't the classiest guy in the league, but what Coburn did was uncalled for.

Hardly. I've seen the replay. Coburn gets into his skates and maybe his leg after the puck drops and the play starts. They were in the face-off circle. So much slashing and playing the stick happens in the face off circle. Coburn didn't hit him above the waist. There was nothing wrong with what he did. Guerin is the one who start crosschecking in front of the net, overreacting. Then he drops the gloves when Coburn retaliates.

Guerin is one of the great American hockey players of the 90s, but he's also a gumpy old man anymore.

[swankymodes]

The NHL will hold a hearing with Philadelphia Flyers forward Daniel Carcillo at 3 p.m. ET Thursday to discuss an incident that took place during the Flyers' Game 1 loss to the Pittsburgh Penguins, 4-1, Wednesday night.

The NHL spoke with all coaches and general managers prior to the start of the playoffs informing them there would be no "message sending" during the latter stages of games. Carcillo got involved with the Penguins' Max Talbot near the end of the game.

Let's hope for the Flyers sake, he gets a suspension, haha. Worst deadline trade of the year.

[sgoodcore]

Watch the replay of that if you can. Coburn slashes him on the legs prior to the puck dropping. So maybe Coburn was trying to impress someone...

Guerin isn't the classiest guy in the league, but what Coburn did was uncalled for.

Hardly. I've seen the replay. Coburn gets into his skates and maybe his leg after the puck drops and the play starts. They were in the face-off circle. So much slashing and playing the stick happens in the face off circle. Coburn didn't hit him above the waist. There was nothing wrong with what he did. Guerin is the one who start crosschecking in front of the net, overreacting. Then he drops the gloves when Coburn retaliates.

Guerin is one of the great American hockey players of the 90s, but he's also a gumpy old man anymore.

I thought what Guerin did was perfect. Sure he was picking a fight with Coburn but Coburn was happy to oblige. He was making sure the Flyers knew they could run around but there would be retribution. Old time hockey man, the shit gets settled on the ice by the players not by the refs. Nothing wrong with that exchange on any level.

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

http://www.wxdx.com/pages/markmadden.html

The Public Enema

Thursday 04-16-2009 1:36pm ET

Scott Hartnell of the Philadelphia Flyers is gifted. He looks like Krusty the Klown and could do "Dumb and Dumber" as a one-man play.

Daniel Carcillo is proof that evolution can work in reverse. Steigy: "Wayne Gretzky thought Carcillo could score 30 goals in a season." Errey: "In what league?"

Meet the new dross. Same as the old dross. The Flyers fool themselves again and again. Their philosophy: "You can never be too big, too tough or too stupid." It hasn't won a Stanley Cup in 34 years, but they adhere to that axiom as if Moses handed it down on stone tablets, which could then be used as weapons.

The Flyers alternated between out-of-control and uncaring at Mellon Arena last night. The result was a 4-1 Penguins victory that was easier than the score indicates.

Hartnell may be the stupidest crap disturber in hockey history. The Penguins took a quick 1-0 lead on a power-play goal, so Hartnell put the Penguins right back on the PP 24 seconds later with a totally unnecessary roughing penalty. Before the first period was over, he picked up two minutes for running goalie Marc-Andre Fleury. He took an offensive-zone tripping penalty in the third period.

To stir the pot effectively, you need a sense of score and situation, and of what you can get away with. Hartnell has none of that.

The Flyers finished the game with a rush of testosterone designed, in their minds, to set the stage for Game 2. But it didn't intimidate the Penguins. It just made them mad. Carcillo cheap-shotted Max Talbot to the back of the head. What did that prove? Who did that scare? Nobody's going to run and hide.

It's just a tired act. It hasn't worked in so long. But Flyers fans and the Philadelphia media remain happily bamboozled, cheerleading accomplices to gangland violence dumbed down to disorganized crime. They're perpetuating a shameful tradition that now produces annual disappointment, not soiled Stanley Cups.

We should be glad. Because as long as the Flyers indulge their Paleozoic preferences, they are not a threat.

Memo to Eric Godard: This series is going to turn to **** sooner, not later. At that point, you get a jersey. At my signal, unleash hell.

[brad]

the only issue i have with the coburn guerin deal is...you are are going to fight, then fight!

coburn slashed his shinpads, no big deal...happens all the time.

guerin took exception to it (and the whole game) so he took a stand, again...good for him.

but, don't just throw the gloves down and hug the guy to the ice.

also lol at everyone thinking the flyers are tough and cheap and people calling for hartnell and carcillo's heads. i went over hartnell's penalties. he was called for two bullshit penalties (roughing and interference) the trip was a trip. it's just absurd. his first rouging was with cooke and alberts. hartnell went to grab him (which that shit happens all the time) but cooke was already wrapped up with alberts. bad call. the interference was a bad call.

it was just a bad game. the flyers aren't goons or dirty and haven't been since the turn of the century.

[kirbypuckett]

the only issue i have with the coburn guerin deal is...you are are going to fight, then fight!

coburn slashed his shinpads, no big deal...happens all the time.

guerin took exception to it (and the whole game) so he took a stand, again...good for him.

but, don't just throw the gloves down and hug the guy to the ice.

also lol at everyone thinking the flyers are tough and cheap and people calling for hartnell and carcillo's heads. i went over hartnell's penalties. he was called for two bullshit penalties (roughing and interference) the trip was a trip. it's just absurd. his first rouging was with cooke and alberts. hartnell went to grab him (which that shit happens all the time) but cooke was already wrapped up with alberts. bad call. the interference was a bad call.

it was just a bad game. the flyers aren't goons or dirty and haven't been since the turn of the century.

So Carcillo taking that faceoff and attempting to injure Talbot wasn't being a goon?

[murakami]

http://igloodreams.blogspot.com/2008/03/flyers-scum.html

this song brings back memories!

[brad]

i will start this off with saying that i'm not trying to bash the pens fans on this board or anything like that but this article is hilariously embarrassing.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=418542

to call the pens a model franchise is astonishing. a model of what exactly?

5 years ago they were the lowest drawing team in the league.

they declared bankruptcy because no one was showing up

they tanked for a while and stockpiled top 5 picks.

they get handed crosby after the lockout

model franchise? what, tank for a while?

The real model franchise in the league is Detroit.

followed by Montreal, the rangers, Toronto, and philly.

[brad]

the only issue i have with the coburn guerin deal is...you are are going to fight, then fight!

coburn slashed his shinpads, no big deal...happens all the time.

guerin took exception to it (and the whole game) so he took a stand, again...good for him.

but, don't just throw the gloves down and hug the guy to the ice.

also lol at everyone thinking the flyers are tough and cheap and people calling for hartnell and carcillo's heads. i went over hartnell's penalties. he was called for two bullshit penalties (roughing and interference) the trip was a trip. it's just absurd. his first rouging was with cooke and alberts. hartnell went to grab him (which that shit happens all the time) but cooke was already wrapped up with alberts. bad call. the interference was a bad call.

it was just a bad game. the flyers aren't goons or dirty and haven't been since the turn of the century.

So Carcillo taking that faceoff and attempting to injure Talbot wasn't being a goon?

cbc never showed a replay of it. so to be honest i haven't seen it and have avoided commenting about it. i just think it's funny writers still equate the flyers to the broad street bullies when they are so so far from it.

[sgoodcore]

Montreal over the past 10 years is hardly a model and neither is Toronto. Philly was also in dead last a few years ago so I'd say they're not a great model. I do agree with Detroit but I'd think you'd have to add in San Jose as at least a better model than Montreal or Philly.

[swankymodes]

I don't see many of these teams as being model franchises other. Pittsburgh for the reasons listed. Philly has a history of not bringing up young talent (until recently) and they just throw money at problems, hence their current salary cap problems. Rangers do the same thing.

I guess I think of teams like San Jose, who do great in a non-hockey market. Same with Nashville who have done a good job getting into the playoffs and putting asses in the seats, also in a non hockey market. The Minnesota Wild also come to mind.

[sgoodcore]

I brought up San Jose because they produced Nabokov, Kipper, and Toskala. They haven't been able to win a Cup but they've been a tough team for a long time.

[brad]

Montreal over the past 10 years is hardly a model and neither is Toronto. Philly was also in dead last a few years ago so I'd say they're not a great model. I do agree with Detroit but I'd think you'd have to add in San Jose as at least a better model than Montreal or Philly.

montreal over it's tenure is one of the most successful franchises in the nhl if not the most. I'm not only talking about wins, i'm talking about being competitive and people showing up. Toronto has a huge fan base. Yes, philly was dead last but then the next year they were in the ECF. how many times have the flyers missed the playoffs in the last 40 years? the flyers have the second best all time winning percentage behind only montreal. they make money hand over fist and were one of the teams who never had any problem attracting free agents.

Yes, San Jose has done very well for themselves.

[brad]

for the teams i mentioned - you just always seem them trying to make the team better, every year. they spend what they need to, they get asses in the seats, and they win a lot of games.

[forgeagain]

As much as I hate to say it, Detroit is definitely the model that all teams should strive to follow. That being said, fuck Detroit.

The Blackhawks are following Pittsburgh's formula for success only with Toews, Kane instead of Crosby, Malkin. They sold out every game this season after fucking 10,000 and under for all non-Detroit games the last few post-lockout years. Of course putting home games on TV helps.

[kirbypuckett]

i will start this off with saying that i'm not trying to bash the pens fans on this board or anything like that but this article is hilariously embarrassing.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=418542

to call the pens a model franchise is astonishing. a model of what exactly?

5 years ago they were the lowest drawing team in the league.

they declared bankruptcy because no one was showing up

they tanked for a while and stockpiled top 5 picks.

they get handed crosby after the lockout

model franchise? what, tank for a while?

The real model franchise in the league is Detroit.

followed by Montreal, the rangers, Toronto, and philly.

Pens tanked, LOL!

Also, did you even read the article? I believe the remarks he made were related to teams who were struggling. He never said "model." Rags to riches was the point.