UNAFRAID TO BURN IN HELL :)

[somethingvinyl]

 but I am 100% for a secular state that keeps religion and governance separate.

 

Yes!

 

I'm still in the theist camp, but I lean more towards classical deism. Still, regardless of whether I choose to employ a deity into my beliefs or not, I'm still all for the separation of church and state.

 

[GradedOnACurve]

the only positive I can see about taking your kids to church (if you're an atheist, that is) is that your kids won't have to answer questions like "why don't you go to church?" at a young age (if only so that I don't have other parents calling me up asking why little billy told their child that there is no god and, more importantly, no santa). aside from that, just read them books (or watch shows, tell stories, etc.) that help teach morals.

 

maybe I'm weird, but I don't get the point of ~atheist churches.  it's perfectly fine to want a sense of community, but aside from not believing in a god, I'm not sure what I'd necessarily have in common with other atheists (aside from "support groups" for help coming out to your family).  why should I care what a "minister" has to say?  it's not like the flying spaghetti monster wrote a "how-to" book on being the perfect atheist and this person has studied it religiously.

 

oh, and I love when religious people ask how you have/learn morals if you're an atheist.  it's called "common sense"

There are always Humanist societies. They promote causes focused solely on the human condition vs divine elements. The are so many causes worth examining/talking about: http://americanhumanist.org

[Aych]

I grew up Southern Baptist, but I never really liked it that much. I only went because my parents made me go, and that's where most of my friends were when I was younger. I stopped going to church as soon as I moved for college, but I still consider myself sort of religious, and I also recognize the value and importance of church in many people's lives.

 

I do think if I started going back to any type of organized "religious" service, it would be Unitarian Universalism. I can dig it.

[topher]

2 days, and this thread still hasn't gotten bogged down with petty squabbling? Good on you, VC.

 

I was raised by Fundamentalist Christian parents. My dad especially. He was also super into the End Times stuff, and I was basically told from the cradle that Jesus was going to come back "any day now", and that everyone would die, but it would be okay because we'll get to spend eternity together in Heaven. Obviously, to a child this stuff is basically fucking psychological abuse, but I shared my family's beliefs throughout my childhood, well into my adolescence. And I was serious about it, too. I went to youth group every week for probably 5 years, and I was pretty much the only kid there that took any of it to heart. Prayed all the time. Rep'ed Jesus to all my friends. The usual.

 

The problem was that I was a natural born skeptic, and I was fascinated by science. I always got that cliche "the Bible and science are two sides of the same story" bit, and I believed it for a very long time. I was into a lot of the Christian apologetics garbage about how the Bible can be interpreted to match science exactly, or how most scientists actually believe in God, or evolution was disproved a long time ago, things like that. The thing that changed my mind was actually Carl Sagan's Cosmos. For real. I was probably 16, watching the whole series on the internet for the first time, and Sagan just had a way of explaining things that I was really enamored with, and he made such a case for scientific skepticism that I just couldn't deny what a colossal idiot I had been. I think I legit cried during the final episode. Finally, it was Sagan's book The Demon Haunted World that pushed me away from my beliefs completely. Anyone into stuff like this should read that book ASAP. It really, really helped me understand skepticism, the nature of evidence, and how destructive faith can be. Beyond that, I won't even get into the countless months I spent researching religions and philosophy before I fully understood the superiority of secular humanism, moral relativism, and methodological naturalism.

 

So yeah, realizing that I was an atheist was probably one of the best things that ever happened to me. For a lot of people, it's a really unimportant footnote in their lives, but it's kinda big for me. Looking back, I think I was legitimately miserable as a Christian. And if I'm ever "outspoken", "annoying" or a "loudmouth", it's because I know there's tons of people like me who could really use some help getting out of where they're at. People can make a case for how helpful religion can be for some, but it really comes down to truth, and if your beliefs aren't true, I find them to be totally meaningless. There isn't one helpful thing that religions and churches do that can't be accomplished by purely secular means. If you want good stuff to happen, you gotta be a part of making it happen. Simple as that.

 

Whew.

[SeeMoreGlass]

Wow, Cool Thread Bros...I guess I'll share...

 

I grew up Catholic, went to catholic school church on Sunday the whole 9 yards...then I got to high school and started taking religion classes where they taught the bible as fact and I just lost all interest because none of it made sense. 

 

I kind of went straight from Catholic to Atheist but it really wasn't till a few years ago that I really started getting interested/involved in why I was an atheist and while I admit that it started out as teenage rebellion, it has really come to be an important core part of who I am. One of the books that I read that really just blew my mind was The Portable Atheist by Christopher Hitchens. It is more of an anthology of other Atheist writings but it really opened my mind to all of the secular literature out there about Atheism and it really made me embrace the concept so much more. I know Hitchens is a somewhat polarizing figure because he can be kind of an asshole, but his debates are quite fascinating and really taught me how to have intelligent conversations about religion/atheism...and sometimes how not to...

 

I really love getting into deep religious conversations with others but have come to realize when and when not to jump into those conversations. One of my friends is on his way to becoming a Methodist minister and one of the things I really treasure about our friendship is that we can have huge discussions about the nature of God and religion without it becoming a shouting match. Sometimes I really feel like he does some major mental gymnastics to get around a lot of biblical literalism, but  he is very knowledgeable about it and really gives me perspective that I didn't have before. I am so intrigued with all of this stuff on a philosophical level and while I will never believe that there is a god (unless someone proves it...i guess) I really enjoy the discussion of it all.

 

The only shitty up-my-own-ass kind of thing I still do is refer to catholic priests as pedophiles to my family and friends. It pisses them off, but it disgusts me how everyone has just forgotten about that whole thing and moved on when almost none of those priests are in jail, and there are probably still a lot of them still abusing children. I have to go to a family wedding next year and it makes me sick to my stomach to think about going into a church and sitting through a full catholic mass when I am so extremely opposed to Catholicism. 

 

My wife and I have also had some interesting discussions and stand on complete opposite sides with Baptism. We don't plan on ever having kids as of right now but there is a possibility and if we do, she wants our child to be baptized right out of the gate and I want to wait until the kid can make the decision for itself. she is more agnostic but still goes to church with her mother on occasion mainly to make her mom happy but its amazing how strong that catholic guilt is...I feel like baptism at birth is indoctrinating the kid into the faith against their will and before they even have a chance to have free will...which I am very morally opposed to, but I think the family pressure and catholic guilt are really playing a big part in her decision making on this because if she didn't have those pressures and was thinking rationally about this I think we could have more of a discussion. It is quite frustrating for me, and I should just let it go because...the whole ceremony is fucking stupid and meaningless anyway, but I am just so morally opposed to it I have a lot of trouble entertaining going through with it. Also, how am I supposed to stand on the altar with my wife and child while a pedo sprinkles water on his/her head and mutters some B.S. about original sin...Its going to be a very sad and difficult day for me. Is it alright to not go to your own child's baptism if you are so morally opposed to it...?

 

Anyways...just some stuff that is rattling around in my brain right now....

 

Also, one of the most difficult things I have ever encountered happened to me about a month ago. My wife's father passed away very very suddenly...It has been awful. The night after the calling hours we went over to a friends and she started drinking. We ended up coming home and she kept asking me if she was ever going to get to see her daddy again...I honestly had no idea what to say...still don't...It really shook me to my core. 

 

Sorry about the long post...I don't get to talk about this stuff much and it was good to vent a little bit...

 

Thanks VC

[maneatingcow]

Just going to put this in here because the song really fits.  It's one of my favorites.

 

[¯\_(ツ)_/¯]

maybe I'm weird, but I don't get the point of ~atheist churches.  it's perfectly fine to want a sense of community, but aside from not believing in a god, I'm not sure what I'd necessarily have in common with other atheists (aside from "support groups" for help coming out to your family).  why should I care what a "minister" has to say?  it's not like the flying spaghetti monster wrote a "how-to" book on being the perfect atheist and this person has studied it religiously.

 

oh, and I love when religious people ask how you have/learn morals if you're an atheist.  it's called "common sense"

 

THIS.  my sister in law goes to an "atheist church", which is basically just a giant potluck with a bunch of weirdos and hippies, and I do NOT get it.  I have nothing in common with 90% of them other than not believing in anything 

[Family Friendly Rap God]

I was raised Christian and fell away from it late highschool/early college. Honestly, the social aspects of going to church were great--I met a lot of nice adult leaders/positive role models, made a lot of close friends in my Wednesday night small group, broke out of my shell w/ girls a lot, etc. I just reached the point where I "outgrew" it. I don't need a fairy tale continuation of life or strict set of rules to be a good person. This is all we have, and we have to make the most out of it. I feel like religion just exists so that people can overcome their fear of death. Or it's used as a crutch in tough times. It's also a product of where you are born. Typically someone born in the US is going to be Christian, while someone in the Middle East is going to be Muslim. Who's right? Who's wrong? Who's going to eternal hell for the lottery of where they were born into this world? Nothing against religious people, I think religion can help a lot of people, it's just not for me. Very much a live and let live mentality, but I will admit that especially in Texas, it's hard to bite your tongue sometimes. Unfortunately like other people mentioned, there's a stigma associated with being an atheist. My mom's response was quote "I raised you better than that" as if not believing in a god means that you can't be a moral person.

This is me to a T. I grew up in the church, going every Sunday, bible studies, youth services and all that. Once I starting thinking about it, religion is a lot of fear mongering. I personally still debate with the idea of a higher/supreme being becasue the Earth and the universe we live are so vast and massive. As far as the Bible, I personally feel that it can be a great guideline for "good living", but you have to be cognizant of the fact that it has been translated multiple times and edited more times than that. There's no logical reason to take it literally.

Although, my Pastor growing up was a great role model and I always respected him for quoting the original Greek text when teaching/preaching.

[topher]

As far as the Bible, I personally feel that it can be a great guideline for "good living", but you have to be cognizant of the fact that it has been translated multiple times and edited more times than that.

 

But the thing is that it's not.

 

Most Christians I know pretty much never crack open a Bible for any occasion. If they did, they'd read about God condoning slavery, genocide, and human sacrifice among other things.

 

The reason Christians don't support these things is because they're genuinely good people with a working moral compass, not because the Bible gives them any reason to feel otherwise.

[Family Friendly Rap God]

But the thing is that it's not.

Most Christians I know pretty much never crack open a Bible for any occasion. If they did, they'd read about God condoning slavery, genocide, and human sacrifice among other things.

The reason Christians don't support these things is because they're genuinely good people with a working moral compass, not because the Bible gives them any reason to feel otherwise.

I should've clarified. I know about those things and that is another part of why I've started to push back against religion. What I meant by good things were some of "Jesus' parables" of good deeds.

I know you don't need a bible to learn these things but I did take some positivity from it.

[smwalsh6]

For the guy talking about the words Theist and Atheist, this if from that Sam Harris book "Letter to a Christian Nation" -

 

“In fact, "atheism" is a term that should not even exist. No one ever needs to identify himself as a "non-astrologer" or a "non-alchemist." We do not have words for people who doubt that Elvis is still alive or that aliens have traversed the galaxy only to molest ranchers and their cattle. Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make in the presence of unjustified religious beliefs.”

 

Short, easy to read book with some pretty blistering take downs. Was more digestible when I was first diving into my doubt head first, but still a good read.

[noalarmplanet]

To quote Patton Oswalt:

 

"I feel, as an atheist, about people like Richard Dawkins and Bill Maher the way that Christians must feel about Fred Phelps. Look, being an atheist means you don’t give a fuck about what anyone believes in. I don’t think any of it’s real, but you can go ahead and do it. I’m not trying to destroy religion. I just don’t care about it. I have my own moral code, as twisted as it is, but it’s not a bunch of old, desert fairy tales that I live by."

[harryq]

did anyone else watch the cnn special tonight on atheism/atheists?  I thought it was alright; nothing too exciting, but not bad.  the highlight of the show was when one kid's parents said talking to their son was weird because it was like "talking to a dead person" I'm thankful for having parents that let me make jesus jokes at christmas...

 

on a related subject, I wish cnn would have a series "[insert (non-)belief here] in america" while they're having that stupid "finding jesus" series.  now that they've had an atheist episode, they could have an episode about muslims, one about buddhists, etc.

[topher]

Relevant:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/03/24/phil-robertson-duck-dynasty-hate-speech_n_6934164.html

 

Edit: Y'know, after reading shit like this, and then having to sit through people telling me how tired they are of hearing about atheists, it's pretty hard to maintain my cool. And there's people who look up to this schmuck?

[noalarmplanet]

Relevant:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/03/24/phil-robertson-duck-dynasty-hate-speech_n_6934164.html

 

Edit: Y'know, after reading shit like this, and then having to sit through people telling me how tired they are of hearing about atheists, it's pretty hard to maintain my cool. And there's people who look up to this schmuck?

WOW. Fuck that guy. 

[̮ ɤ ̮]

Sometimes I'm glad to live in a country, that hasn't such fucked up idiots.

[batman]

Sometimes I'm glad to live in a country, that hasn't such fucked up idiots.

you can say that now, but only a few generations ago...

[harryq]

Relevant:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/03/24/phil-robertson-duck-dynasty-hate-speech_n_6934164.html

 

Edit: Y'know, after reading shit like this, and then having to sit through people telling me how tired they are of hearing about atheists, it's pretty hard to maintain my cool. And there's people who look up to this schmuck?

 

if there's a "good" takeaway from that is that if you listen to the audio, the crowd goes pretty silent once he starts talking about rape and decapitation, so hopefully that's a sign that even his ~supporters were like "wtf?"

[anthemforadoomed]

I saw this ad on Comedy Central today. Then a Jolly Ranchers ad came on.

[Bladewillisisdead]

Fact: No one who believes in god has ever done anything bad.

[+hecollec+or]

you can say that now, but only a few generations ago...

 

I want to upvote this.... but it just feels wrong.

[noalarmplanet]

I want to upvote this.... but it just feels wrong.

Dosen't feel reich does it? 

[GradedOnACurve]

Sometimes I'm glad to live in a country, that hasn't such fucked up idiots.

 

Every country has them. Our idiots are just loud and like to continually embarrass themselves.

[batman]

Dosen't feel reich does it?

Quit Stalin and give this man some upmarx

[+hecollec+or]