Vinyl Faults/Quality

[jsim86]

Hi,

I purchased a reasonably inexpensive turntable a few years back because I wanted to experience and be part of the resurgence in Vinyl. I have bought a number of vinyl records since then (possibly 40+), but have encountered difficulties (mainly skipping) in a fair number of them. Is this common? When you spend £20+ on a record you expect it to work efficiently, but it seems that this problem has occurred with me more often than it should. You might be tempted to say that this has got something to do with the cheap vinyl player, but if this is the case, then why do the majority of my purchases work without any problem? There could be as many as 10 vinyl in my collection with this fault and while I have sent some back for exchange, this really shouldn't need to be the case. Can anyone shed any light on why this is happening so often? Do those who produce the records not do so with utmost diligence and care? I am becoming increasingly frustrated with my vinyl as a result and have decided that I am not purchasing any more, at least until I can get to the route of this issue, which is deeply disappointing. Thanks in advance for any words of wisdom. 

[tape]

If a large number of the records you have skip fairly regularly, the thing my mind immediately jumps to is that your tonearm weight is miscalibrated. If your turntable is really cheap you might not be able to adjust it at all. If you have an adjustable counterweight, etc. on your turntable, check out the manual to see how to properly adjust it, and hopefully that will help.

[copelandkid]

it's almost certainly the turntable and you are returning perfectly fine records in all likelihood. i did this too at the outset of my vinyl journey, was so confused by the process. definitely don't give up on the seemingly faulty records you have and have a look around for cheaper used alternatives that have counterweight adjustment to the tonearm and such.

[mitchard]

Definitely an issue with the turntable if you're experiencing this with a bunch of different records.

As mentioned above, the problem is likely inaccurate tracking force due to a the counterweight not being set correctly. Balancing your tonearm is a fairly simple/quick fix, assuming your turntable does have a counterweight. Unfortunately, most reasonably inexpensive turntables don't have one.

https://longplayvinyl.com/balance-tonearm/

Skipping is generally due to the tracking force being too low, which causes the needle to essentially bounce on the vinyl. This is especially apparent if the album has even a slight warp.

If there isn't a counterweight to adjust, you can always try the old school trick of putting a penny on top of the head shell, to see if the additional weight fixes the issue. This isn't a long term fix (and can eventually damage both the needle and the records), but it would be a pretty sure sign that the balance is to blame for your issues. 

[jsim86]

Thank you so much for your responses. I don’t think I am able to adjust/reconfigure the tonearm of my turntable in any way, possibly due to the fact that it is a cheap one. Can I ask all of you why this would only be happening with select records? I know that with one of the vinyl at least that I returned for an exchange, that the new exchanged record worked perfectly well and did not have the same problems as the original. Why would this be the case? I should also point out that the skipping occurs only in certain places on the record, but it’s the exact same places each time round I play. I would be very reluctant to splash out on a higher-end turntable, as my initial intention was to only to engage with the vinyl resurgence and the turntable that I have allows me to do that for the most part. I’m still not convinced that I haven’t just been very unfortunate with my vinyl purchases, although I have been buying new and from reputable retailers. Interestingly, when I mentioned this problem to a friend, he too suggested that it may be a ‘balancing’ issue. 

[Dub]

As mentioned by someone else, there could be a minor warp in your record that a cheap turntable can’t compensate for.  I would take advice of everyone here and accept it’s your turntable.  There are lps with defects that can’t be dealt with regardless of the turntable.  Those do happen from time to time, but nowhere near your experience.  Try the penny trick someone mentioned.  If that fixes the issue, you’ve got a decision to make.  Either buy a better turntable (with a counter weight ), be content with your setup’s issues or stop listening to vinyl.

[mitchard]

Yeah, around 25% of your records sharing the same issue still points to the turntable being the issue. I probably have close to 2000 pieces of vinyl now, and very (very) few actually have pressing defects that cause skips. I could probably count them on one hand.

The fact that it's happening with select records is hard to really pinpoint. One copy may have had a tiny warp, that was just enough to bump the needle up. Maybe the grooves are holding dirt, or there are imperfections in the grooves you can't see. It could be anything. 

Definitely try the  penny thing and report back. 

[TheGhostOfRandySavage]

6 hours ago, mitchard said:

Yeah, around 25% of your records sharing the same issue still points to the turntable being the issue. I probably have close to 2000 pieces of vinyl now, and very (very) few actually have pressing defects that cause skips. I could probably count them on one hand.

The fact that it's happening with select records is hard to really pinpoint. One copy may have had a tiny warp, that was just enough to bump the needle up. Maybe the grooves are holding dirt, or there are imperfections in the grooves you can't see. It could be anything. 

Definitely try the  penny thing and report back. 

Yup. Got my first skip in years the other day and it's clear there is a gnarly scratch I just didn't notice at first.

[tokimedo]

8 hours ago, mitchard said:

Yeah, around 25% of your records sharing the same issue still points to the turntable being the issue. I probably have close to 2000 pieces of vinyl now, and very (very) few actually have pressing defects that cause skips. I could probably count them on one hand.

The fact that it's happening with select records is hard to really pinpoint. One copy may have had a tiny warp, that was just enough to bump the needle up. Maybe the grooves are holding dirt, or there are imperfections in the grooves you can't see. It could be anything. 

Definitely try the  penny thing and report back. 

also could be the mix. if its really low end, or bass heavy, it could be making the arm jump.

[Shelby]

I've had skipping problems on exactly 2 records from the thousands I've played the last 15 years. It's your turntable.

[tokimedo]

On 6/28/2023 at 12:30 PM, jsim86 said:

Thank you so much for your responses. I don’t think I am able to adjust/reconfigure the tonearm of my turntable in any way, possibly due to the fact that it is a cheap one. Can I ask all of you why this would only be happening with select records? I know that with one of the vinyl at least that I returned for an exchange, that the new exchanged record worked perfectly well and did not have the same problems as the original. Why would this be the case? I should also point out that the skipping occurs only in certain places on the record, but it’s the exact same places each time round I play. I would be very reluctant to splash out on a higher-end turntable, as my initial intention was to only to engage with the vinyl resurgence and the turntable that I have allows me to do that for the most part. I’m still not convinced that I haven’t just been very unfortunate with my vinyl purchases, although I have been buying new and from reputable retailers. Interestingly, when I mentioned this problem to a friend, he too suggested that it may be a ‘balancing’ issue. 

vinyl is a slippery slope, its not something you can just dip your toes in. as some people say here its "the hobby".... you may as well spend the money to get a nice setup that you can have for the rest of your vinyl listening life and casually listen to vinyl at your leisure, vs having a suitcase crosley that destroys the grooves of your records every time you play them cause you want to "engage" with the "vinyl resurgence". the way you word this sentence, it makes me feel like you just want to collect vinyl cause its cool, and that seems douchey. either you're in, or you're out imo.

 

[jsim86]

I must be honest and say that I was keen to realise what all of the fuss was about in relation to vinyl and perhaps, somewhat naively, jumped in and purchased the cheap record player. It looks as if I am going to have to accept that this is indeed the problem. I didn't really intend on spending hundreds of pounds (dollars) on a high-end turntable, but this might well be what is required to eradicate these issues. Do I like the traditional sound and quality that you get with vinyl listening? Yes, but my personal experience has somewhat dampened my enthusiasm. Accepting that a more proven turntable would result in a much better experience, would go a long way to ensuring that I was much more content with what I consider to be an 'alternative' way to enjoying music. If I am not willing to splash out on a better system, then perhaps I should stick to listening to my tracks (MP3s) via a Bluetooth speaker, which I must admit, wouldn't have anywhere near the same(if any at all) difficulties that I have outlined with vinyl. It's a decision that I must make, but I thank all of you for your contributions.

[faaip de oiad]

2 hours ago, jsim86 said:

I must be honest and say that I was keen to realise what all of the fuss was about in relation to vinyl and perhaps, somewhat naively, jumped in and purchased the cheap record player. It looks as if I am going to have to accept that this is indeed the problem. I didn't really intend on spending hundreds of pounds (dollars) on a high-end turntable, but this might well be what is required to eradicate these issues. Do I like the traditional sound and quality that you get with vinyl listening? Yes, but my personal experience has somewhat dampened my enthusiasm. Accepting that a more proven turntable would result in a much better experience, would go a long way to ensuring that I was much more content with what I consider to be an 'alternative' way to enjoying music. If I am not willing to splash out on a better system, then perhaps I should stick to listening to my tracks (MP3s) via a Bluetooth speaker, which I must admit, wouldn't have anywhere near the same(if any at all) difficulties that I have outlined with vinyl. It's a decision that I must make, but I thank all of you for your contributions.

Not sure if you are aware of the DunningKruger effect, but most people who begin their vinyl journey could be summed up in this graph here. Confidence is really high when beginning this hobby. But once you begin to learn the ins and outs of the hobby, you enter the "valley of despair". So, you start learning and realize that that vinyl isn't as simple as you were led to believe(mostly because of the corporate takeover- but also fads). It used to be really easy and simple and cheap back in the day. But I digress. 

If you're serious, just keep at it. If you love music it can be very rewarding. But if you are following fads or the latest tic tac/Instatrash thing, you will be very disappointed. 

Anyways, my 2cents.

[LIGMA_BALLZ]

I’m a firm believer you don’t have to spend hundreds of dollars to get a decent setup.  Everything I own is either second hand or open box.  I got a fluance turntable 2 weeks ago for $75 from Facebook marketplace.  You can find deals out there 

[TheGhostOfRandySavage]

1 hour ago, LIGMA_BALLZ said:

I’m a firm believer you don’t have to spend hundreds of dollars to get a decent setup.  Everything I own is either second hand or open box.  I got a fluance turntable 2 weeks ago for $75 from Facebook marketplace.  You can find deals out there 

You can definitely wait for deals on stuff and get a pretty decent setup for not a ton of money.

 

I've thrifted most of my stuff too but I blew a wad of cash the other day at the thrift store on a Pioneer PL-550 that was steep for thrift prices, but still a steal for the condition it was in and came with all its parts. I absolutely adore my all vintage setup now, and have a Debut Carbon DC that is gathering dust until I decide what to do with it.

 

 

[LIGMA_BALLZ]

1 hour ago, TheGhostOfRandySavage said:

You can definitely wait for deals on stuff and get a pretty decent setup for not a ton of money.

 

I've thrifted most of my stuff too but I blew a wad of cash the other day at the thrift store on a Pioneer PL-550 that was steep for thrift prices, but still a steal for the condition it was in and came with all its parts. I absolutely adore my all vintage setup now, and have a Debut Carbon DC that is gathering dust until I decide what to do with it.

 

 

Nice!  I think the only thing that I’ve bought brand new is my current stylus.  I watch a lot of cheap audio man on YouTube.  He’s sold me on some Sony bookshelf speakers I got open box.  Love em

[bjorn]

Buying a turntable is a bit like buying a musical instrument. You want want to avoid cheap plastic parts at all costs. You also wouldn’t expect to buy a proper one new for less than a few hundred. That being said, I‘ve also bought several turntables used for less than a hundred that work great, though usually I end up doing a little tinkering to get them properly set up. Old Duals and Garrards are generally easy to find for cheap, but there are many other options.

[Dr Robert]

I've never got so many defective record as in the last year. I started to inspect them and learned to recognize what the various defects look like and I discovered that non-fill is the worst. I hate that stitching sound. After that I learned which are the pressing plants that produce those records and try to avoid them. This hobby is becoming stressful than my job

Edited July 8, 2023 by Dr Robert

[Shelby]

2 hours ago, Dr Robert said:

I've never got so many defective record as in the last year. I started to inspect them and learned to recognize what the various defects look like and I discovered that non-fill is the worst. I hate that stitching sound. After that I learned which are the pressing plants that produce those records and try to avoid them. This hobby is becoming stressful than my job

There aren't any pressing plants that just have non-fill by default... that's kinda ridiculous to say. They'd be closed. Like Rainbo.

[Dr Robert]

7 hours ago, Shelby said:

There aren't any pressing plants that just have non-fill by default... that's kinda ridiculous to say. They'd be closed. Like Rainbo.

I never said that. It's by probability, 80% of LP pressed by certain plants have non-fills, warps, and so on. I tend to avoid them if possible

[Shelby]

7 hours ago, Dr Robert said:

I never said that. It's by probability, 80% of LP pressed by certain plants have non-fills, warps, and so on. I tend to avoid them if possible

That still makes no sense and isn't true. Which plants?

[LIGMA_BALLZ]