mcm1610 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 For those who apparently live under a rock or just didn't pay attention... What's the cliffnotes of this story? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonesomexloveus Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 apparently I wrote too much and my message became unclear, so here's a shorter version in bold, for emphasis: horrible people do horrible things, but doing a horrible thing doesn't necessarily make you a horrible person. replace "horrible people" with "rapists" and so on, and you'll get my point. just because I don't consider these guys to be rapists doesn't mean what they did is any less bad, nor does it imply that the blame isn't squarely on them (as opposed to partially blaming the girl. I suppose technically I'd place some blame on society as a whole, but that's overthinking things). and if I find out that either of these guys has a history of rape, I'll be sure to bump this thread, retract that statement, and declare them a "person who commits rape" (note that it says "commits", suggesting multiple times, and not "committed", once in the past). and as for the alcohol part, yes, it's a catalyst, but I'm not sure what the motivations here were (particularly the activities that took place at the house when the girl was passed out). were they sexual or more to degrade/humiliate? I don't know about you, but I've never thought after sex "damn, that sex was great. now if only I could pee on her...", while humiliating the person who just passed out at a party seems pretty standard (and in this case, taken to a criminal level). either way, it's wrong. no argument there edit: one more thing and then I'll shut up. the news reports about these guys having good grades and promising futures and whatnot make an already sad story (a girl being raped) worse. it's easy/convenient/comfortable to think that evil things (e.g., rape) are only done by evil people (e.g., "rapists"), but when you allow yourself to realize that "good kids" can do horrible things, that's when shit gets real. it's uncomfortable, and that's why I'm glad the news reported it. I'm not saying these guys are/were "good kids", but still i don't understand why you don't consider them rapists. they. raped. a. girl. that makes you a rapist, whether you're a high school kid with good grades and no priors, or some vagrant who serially kidnaps and rapes people, then chops them up and puts their eyeballs in jars. daegor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GradedOnACurve Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Guys lets all get it right. They are now convicted rapists. lonesomexloveus, sjb2k1 and Satan 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 For those who apparently live under a rock or just didn't pay attention... What's the cliffnotes of this story? i don't think i'm clear enough on the story to provide this. but it reminded me that a new youtube series is happening through reddit where things like the syria crisis is explained so 5 year olds can understand it. i don't know about anyone else, but i'm super excited about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPancakes Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 i don't think i'm clear enough on the story to provide this. but it reminded me that a new youtube series is happening through reddit where things like the syria crisis is explained so 5 year olds can understand it. i don't know about anyone else, but i'm super excited about it. if you want to learn about syria id suggest this: http://www.vice.com/read/the-vice-guide-to-syria-0000456-v19n11 also, there is no ambiguity here; what happened was rape, and mays and richmond are rapists. they are also horrible people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffnovak Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 apparently I wrote too much and my message became unclear, so here's a shorter version in bold, for emphasis: horrible people do horrible things, but doing a horrible thing doesn't necessarily make you a horrible person. replace "horrible people" with "rapists" and so on, and you'll get my point. just because I don't consider these guys to be rapists doesn't mean what they did is any less bad, nor does it imply that the blame isn't squarely on them (as opposed to partially blaming the girl. I suppose technically I'd place some blame on society as a whole, but that's overthinking things). and if I find out that either of these guys has a history of rape, I'll be sure to bump this thread, retract that statement, and declare them a "person who commits rape" (note that it says "commits", suggesting multiple times, and not "committed", once in the past). and as for the alcohol part, yes, it's a catalyst, but I'm not sure what the motivations here were (particularly the activities that took place at the house when the girl was passed out). were they sexual or more to degrade/humiliate? I don't know about you, but I've never thought after sex "damn, that sex was great. now if only I could pee on her...", while humiliating the person who just passed out at a party seems pretty standard (and in this case, taken to a criminal level). either way, it's wrong. no argument there edit: one more thing and then I'll shut up. the news reports about these guys having good grades and promising futures and whatnot make an already sad story (a girl being raped) worse. it's easy/convenient/comfortable to think that evil things (e.g., rape) are only done by evil people (e.g., "rapists"), but when you allow yourself to realize that "good kids" can do horrible things, that's when shit gets real. it's uncomfortable, and that's why I'm glad the news reported it. I'm not saying these guys are/were "good kids", but still I don't understand this... if she said "no," it's rape. If she COULDN'T say "no," it's rape, if she didn't say anything, it's rape. Therefore, they were rapists before the conviction, but it's even more black and white now, as they're convicted rapists. Also, regardless if a person commits it once or 1000 times, they are a rapist after the first time. oohdoiloveyou, lonesomexloveus and daegor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steventangent Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Uuugghhhh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamover Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 rapists do horrible things, but doing a horrible thing doesn't necessarily make you a rapist. replace "horrible people" with "rapists" and so on, and you'll get my point. now replace horrible thing with "rape" rapists rape, but doing a rape doesn't make you a rapist. yes it does. daegor and lonesomexloveus 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgato48 Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 and now there is another case. http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/torrington-steubenville-rape-assault-victim-twitter-163530296.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 hey new york, how do you feel about connecticut trying so hard to be your little brother now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 maybe it's because i ignored steubenville early on out of sickness, but the torrington story reads so much more realistically. i can so easily picture this awful behavior from a bunch of high schoolers, because they're all despicable teenage assholes. of course they act this way. the block quote at the end is perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 aye yi yi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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