Beginner’s Guide to Turntables & Hi–Fi *READ 1st PAGE BEFORE POSTING NEW THREADS / BASIC QUESTIONS*

[mesi]

Nah man, the acrylic platter measures 12" in diameter, the platter on the standard Debut measures 10" in diameter. But like I said, I don't think they even sell them anymore.

Here's a video that kind of illustrates the "overhang" on the standard Debut 10" platter:

It's tough to see, but once you see it it's hard to miss

Edit: here's a pic that kind of succeeds in showing this:

and here's one with the acrylic platter:

the difference is quite obvious.

Thanks for the clarification, then I take back everything I said. Specifications on the product page I posted earlier said that the dimensions were the same as for the acyrlic platter, which I own.

[Eliminator Jr.]

So is the standard platter of the Debut Carbon DC from your link the same measure as the acrylic platter? 

And in case you've missed my last post on the previous page, do you have any recommendations on which cartridge to get considering the inner groove distortion?

[slinch]

Yeah, every Carbon model has a 12" platter, so you're safe whichever you buy.

 

As for inner groove distortion, I cannot really comment as I haven't tried that many carts, but at least from my experience the problem is usually with the pressing, and while a really good cart-tonearm combination will reduce the problem, it mostly comes down to the pressing itself.

 

Maybe someone who has tried both the OM10 and the 2M Red can give you some more insight, but I'd guess that the 2M is a better choice.

[allenh]

Yeah, every Carbon model has a 12" platter, so you're safe whichever you buy.

 

As for inner groove distortion, I cannot really comment as I haven't tried that many carts, but at least from my experience the problem is usually with the pressing, and while a really good cart-tonearm combination will reduce the problem, it mostly comes down to the pressing itself.

 

Maybe someone who has tried both the OM10 and the 2M Red can give you some more insight, but I'd guess that the 2M is a better choice.

 

Pretty much that.

 

Some carts get a bad reputation for IGD, Grado's for instance, I'm using a Grado on one of my turntables and IGD is not a problem but it is set up as near perfect as possible. It does very much depend on turntable geometry and compatibility with the arm and it's usually that and not the cart as a product that's at fault. The Ortofons in general are not bad with IGD, there are others that are better and others that are worse but mostly the differences are down to stylus profile so with the 2M you can try the blue stylus as it fits the same body if it gives you a problem in the Project but as Project use it in a lot of their turntables I doubt they will have chosen a cart that makes their product sound bad.

 

I personally am not a fan of the modern Ortofon sound but that's a personal choice and I can say trackability I've always found to be good with them.

[Eliminator Jr.]

Thanks for the help and recommendations guys! I'm down to a mere two contestants.

 

http://www.phonophono.de/phono/plattenspieler/pro-ject-debut-carbon.html

 

That's the one I was recommended by slinch with the 2m red totalling at 400 bucks.

 

Now I found this:

 

https://www.hifisound.de/Hifi-Komponenten/PRO-JECT-DEBUT-CARBON-AC-ESPRIT-MIT-ORTOFON-2M-RED-HOCHGLANZ-SCHWARZ.html?gclid=CLzsvqjC78ACFabLtAodvyYA0Q

 

That's quite a deal right? Or are there any disadvantages with the acrylic platter one that I didn't catch? To me it looks like the exakt same model, just withe the acriylic update, but for the same price..

[slinch]

Well the above one is the DC model with the new motor, which "should" have better speed stability (I wrote "should" because I haven't seen any reviews on it yet as it's relatively new). The one in the second link is the old AC model. One thing to note: many people have reported lots of hum with their carbon tables (the old AC models). I believe the problem is limited to the North American market, could be because of the different power supplies (lower voltage AC outlets). Usually the store will swap the faulty models, but I've also read that some of the replacements had the same issue. Again, I haven't noticed people writing about this problem here in Europe, but I cannot say for certain that it isn't there.

 

I guess if 400 is your limit I'd try first with the old AC model with the acrylic platter, worst case scenario is that if it ends up giving you problems you can send it back and exchange it for the new DC version with the standard platter, so all you lose is a little time.

[Eliminator Jr.]

Read into the AC-model humming problems a bit and I'd be pretty bummed if it was the case. So I made up my mind and decided to throw in an extra 50 bucks for the Debut Carbon DC Esprit. DC to be on the safe side of power supplies related humming issues and Esprit 'cause I really fell for the acrylic platter. Just looks so damn fine and even if it doesn't add much to the sound quality, 50€ on top seems reasonable considering that an update down the road would cost about 130..

[allenh]

I doubt the humming would be such an issue in Europe as I think it's down to the neutral not being tied to earth in the US as we do in Europe.

[Eliminator Jr.]

I doubt the humming would be such an issue in Europe as I think it's down to the neutral not being tied to earth in the US as we do in Europe.

Would you mind explaining the "neutral not being tied to the earth"-part a bit?

[allenh]

Not sure how deep I have to go with this and this is how it was explained to me, In the US they use centre tapped transformers for the domestic mains (sometimes wrongly referred to as 2 phase) with both conductors either side of zero (the centre tap / neutral) and with 220v between them (they use one side and neutral to give 110v) so neither is directly referenced to earth but in Europe we use a single phase and neutral with the low side of the supply wiring (neutral) tied to earth at the electricity sub station. This means that in the US the supply is always what is referred to as floating and the electrical noise is difficult to drain but in Europe because the neutral is referenced it tends to drain to earth, with most electronics with a decent power supply doing the conversion from AC mains to DC to power it this noise is dealt with but not always and it shows up more in DC only supplied items as the little psu isn't well enough designed to get rid of the noise

[Eliminator Jr.]

Thanks for the detailed answer!

 

 

This means that in the US the supply is always what is referred to as floating and the electrical noise is difficult to drain but in Europe because the neutral is referenced it tends to drain to earth, with most electronics with a decent power supply doing the conversion from AC mains to DC to power it this noise is dealt with but not always and it shows up more in DC only supplied items as the little psu isn't well enough designed to get rid of the noise

 

Do I understand correctly that the AC would be the better choice for us Europeans?

[allenh]

That statement refers to the US and is why they have so many noise problems with DC units that are powered from the little plug in PSU's, it's much less of a problem for us noise wise because of our tying neutral to ground before it gets to your house and as Slinch says the DC motor version should be more stable anyway so that would be my preference.

 

To be honest DC for a turntable motor is always my preference and if I was in the US I would build a decent PSU.

[Eliminator Jr.]

That statement refers to the US and is why they have so many noise problems with DC units that are powered from the little plug in PSU's, it's much less of a problem for us noise wise because of our tying neutral to ground before it gets to your house and as Slinch says the DC motor version should be more stable anyway so that would be my preference.

 

To be honest DC for a turntable motor is always my preference and if I was in the US I would build a decent PSU.

 

Thanks man, helps a lot!

[BigSeth]

Looking for some advice. Looking to upgrade my system for time since the complete overhaul. I'm thinking the best investment, most cost efficient upgrade for sound and my collection is a cleaner. I'm pretty positive I want to get the Audio Advisor Record Doctor. Seems like a great value for a vacuum type cleaner. I might have some money to upgrade another portion of my system. I'm thinking either SpeedBox, Acrylic platter, or preamp (I have a Debut Carbon, surprising I know). From what I've seen over the years in these types of threads is preamp is a very good first upgrade sonically. In this case I've been considering the Cambridge Audio Azure 551p or the Pro-ject phono box S. Any comments or recommendations on that are welcome. I'm also considering the SpeedBox because I've read it's a nice sonic upgrade and throwing on a 12" and having it cut at 45rpm with no specification anywhere then getting it in "slo-mo" just annoys me. It just messes up my rhythm, so to speak. So, the SpeedBox would help with that. The Acrylic platter isn't a high priority, I manage the static issue just fine but still something to consider. I'm also wondering if getting a Spin Clean would be a good idea so I could save some money to use towards upgrading more components. Just noting my set up is, Debut Carbon ---> Yamaha AS500 Integrated ----> Wharfedale Diamond 10.1s (Again, surprising I know.) 

 

Anyway, sorry that was a bit of a ramble. Just looking for some more knowledgeable input. 

[snp304]

With a turntable there are a lot of things that influence the sound, you are probably right about your Technics sounding flat but you do have to take the on board phono stage in your receiver and the cartridge you are using into account as well some other less influential things.

so, I bought a Onkyo amp/preamp combo and hooked it up...needless to say, the phono out on the Kenwood was the problem...Now I can enjoy vinyl the way it was supposed to sound....bring on the Rega RP3 early next year...can't wait

[chilltown38]

Looking for some insight, I'm in the market for some new speakers and the Epos Epic 2 has really caught my eye. Sad to say I missed out on the sale a while back on these. My receiver is a Pioneer SX-1010, was wondering if these speakers would pair well with its warm sound?

[Shinji]

I'm in need of a new dry brush. I bought the AudioQuest brush about three months ago, and noticed my records starting sounding noisier, but I could not pinpoint exactly why. I just put on a white record and realized that the bristles have been coming off and into the grooves, like, a lot. It's crazy. I use the brush properly, and I don't dig it into the grooves, so I'm thinking this brush just sucks. Any better, sure-fire alternatives? I have tried two types of carbon fiber brushes, the old and new discwasher, and they all have big downfalls.

EDIT: Just used my dry micro fiber cloths, seems to have worked decently.

[anthemforadoomed]

I'm in need of a new dry brush. I bought the AudioQuest brush about three months ago, and noticed my records starting sounding noisier, but I could not pinpoint exactly why. I just put on a white record and realized that the bristles have been coming off and into the grooves, like, a lot. It's crazy. I use the brush properly, and I don't dig it into the grooves, so I'm thinking this brush just sucks. Any better, sure-fire alternatives? I have tried two types of carbon fiber brushes, the old and new discwasher, and they all have big downfalls.

EDIT: Just used my dry micro fiber cloths, seems to have worked decently.

There's so much shit talk on different brushes on here but not a lot of positive stuff. I have no idea what a good brush even is because VC can't agree. What is the Debut Carbon/ Marantz of brushes VC?!

[ajxd]

Theres a lot of shit talk bc they are all essentially the exact same thing, just rebranded. And none of them are that great.

[Jetboy]

I also have the same issue with my Audio Quest brush causing more noise when I use it.

[biodigitaljazz]

The MoFi dry brush is good enough. I use it.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Mobile-Fidelity-Record-Cleaning-Brush/dp/B003DX0S2Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1412197503&sr=8-1&keywords=mobile+fidelity+dry+brush

[carryonkid]

So, I just upgraded to a Uturn Orbit from an ATLP60 but I have it all plugged in to some awful Logitech computer speakers. I'm looking into buying a pair of Micca MB42X with a Cambridge Azur 551P  and a Dayton Audio DTA-1 amp. Would this be a solid setup? I don't really have much room in my budget to move beyond this, but I'd greatly appreciate any suggestions. 

[kramer73]

The wife hates my current speakers and receiver, so I have a lot of reading to do. She's thinking something with HDMI hookups.

[ajxd]

Divorce her. Simple fix.

[anthemforadoomed]

Simple.